Hey Eileen,

I've wanted the opportunity to get back to you for days, but I've had an unusual number of demands on my time this week.

Everything you shared feels true for me too. Thank you.

A few years ago, I attended a lecture by Susan M. Quattrociocchi, Ph.D. on how to help your high school student discover their inborn talents and plan for their careers.

It was a good lecture. As she explained that there are many paths to a career - (not just a four year degree) - I became increasingly impatient. My thoughts were, "Yes, I agree, but how do you figure out what talents your child has and what career they should choose? I haven't figured this out for myself yet, and I'm in my 40's! This is easier said than done!"

A parent finally stood up and asked the question. And much to my delight, she had an answer.

For the previous five years or so, she had been studying the happiness research. What she gleaned from that research is to "Do what makes your heart glad."

She then gave us a simple exercise to do daily, multiple times a day even. Here's the questions: "What am I doing?"; "Who am I doing it with?"; How am I feeling, as I do the task and as I do it with the person I am with, on a scale of 1 - 5?" or "How engaged, motivated do I feel?"

She went on to explain that by asking and answering these questions on a regular basis, we will learn what we like, what we don't like, what we're good at, and what we're not good at, who we like to spend time with, and who we don't like to spend time with. This is, of course, almost what you said word for word.

She also explained that we are all born with inborn talents and that our challenge is to identify those inborn talents and then to increase our skill level with training and practice. 

I attended that lecture three or four years ago. I've been asking and answering those questions ever since. It continues to  help me.

What I learned is that I deeply enjoy listening to people's stories, but more than that, I enjoy joining with them and supporting them in their process of becoming who they are meant to be.

I thought up until recently that I could be satisfied doing this as an advocate, but then two things happened in one day that shifted my thinking.

I was at work. A psychology student arrived at our Center to meet with a client. He hadn't scheduled the meeting so we had a schedule conflict. Complicating matters further, the client was late.

We began talking and I learned that he was well on his way to becoming a counselor and joining his father's counseling practice in a nearby community. He expressed how nervous he felt at the prospect of beginning to work with people as he completes his training. I identified strongly with what he said. My sense after talking with him was that he would do just fine.

Later on that day, at my afternoon job in Human Resources, I was catching up on my filing when I suddenly found myself asking, "What are you doing?" and "What does this have to do with what you enjoy doing?"

For the first time I finally got that I'm just as capable as the people I'm working for, that the only difference between us is that they've done the work to earn the positions they are in and I haven't. That was the moment I decided to go back to school to study psychology.

I have no idea what I'm going to do with the degree. I used to think that if you study psychology you have to become a counselor. I realize now how silly that is. In our Human Resources office, each staff member comes from a different background: social work, business, medical office management, law, computer science, etc. 

I'm open to the idea of becoming a counselor but I'm also open to seeing where the journey takes me.

I began reading psychology articles when I was a teenager. Don't know what drove this interest, it was just always there and continues today. 

I come from a family of engineers, both sides. My father trained as a chemist but worked as a technical writer. He enjoyed reading about archeology and anthropology. My mother trained in Biology but dedicated much of her adult life to the arts. She painted, directed and acted in community theater, and played the accoustic guitar. I later learned that her grandfather and great grandfather were Congregational Ministers. Perhaps there's a connection there too. I don't know. I guess it's enough to say, what is, is.

Thanks Eileen for sharing your personal experiences. It's validating to know that I'm not the only one who has worked in a wide variety of jobs and industries. I too feel each of those jobs played an important role in getting to the place I am today.

Grandma Lise

Hey Terri,

I love the process you took your daughter through that day: 

"Instead of talking about specific career choices, I asked her what she's passionate about. What triggers her heart and brain? What could she see herself doing for the rest of her life, even if the pay was lousy or non-existant? This opened up a fascinating dialogue between us and she has since used this to help guide her in her future career path. Her focus started on WHAT she likes and is passionate about, not HOW to get there."

I thought it best to answer your questions directly:

You like the administrative work but hate the details and technology. What exactly is it about that sort of career that you DO like? And can you do it without the parts that are tripping you up?

I like working in a team environment with staff for the purpose of meeting our customers needs in a meaningful, not superficial, manner.

Currently, I make $10 an hour in my non-profit job and $13 an hour in my goverment job. Neither provide benefits unless you count being allowed to take time off whenever I want!

It's not that I don't like attending to details, it's just that my ADD interfers with my ability to work at the level of detail required of Administrative Professionals. I have never been able to create a document that didn't have one to two mistakes, even with proof reading. Though having said that, my work is in no way bad. It more than meets the minimal standards of the work. It's just that it's such a bummer when one of those mistakes creates unneccesary work for yourself or others. Particularly when one of your bosses is a stickler for detail, and trust me, there's one in every office.

For three years, I have attended monthly meetings of Administrative Professionals. I appreciate and value their professionalism and ability to organize, generate, and maintain records of information. They amaze me in their ability to work with people as they maintain order and organization in addition to learning how to better use their office's computer software and systems. I guess my hope was that if I associated with them, it would eventually spark my interest. It didn't. I am so not like them.

How can you generalize those activities into a different career? You mentioned social work. What is it about social work that you might enjoy? Know that social workers also have tons of paperwork!

You're right, I don't particularly like paperwork. But then, honestly, I've come to know a lot of professionals in the helping professions who don't like the paperwork either. If they do exist, I think they must work for the Department of Social and Health Services or in other goverment jobs. 

My husband and I were listening to National Public Radio the other day. They did a series of interviews with people in different careers about what they liked and didn't like about their work. One of the interveiws was with astronauts at NASA. The astronauts commented that whenever they hear someone outside of their field say "it's not rocket science" they can't help but laugh. The reason? Because 90% of their work has nothing to do with flying in machines with big jet engines. They spend most of their time doing paperwork and giving tours.

I'm like those astronauts. I like helping people and if I have to do paperwork to help people, so be it. At least I'll be doing what I like to do at least part of the time.

What would it take to get that degree? Is going back to school an option? Would you love that? Or hate it?

It's going to take a lot of work and angst. I struggle daily with learning and memory differences. And that is exactly what has kept me from going back to school sooner.

But, you know, to participate on this forum, I have to do a lot of research, reading, and reflecting before I respond to most posts. I guess what I've realized in the last two months here is, how does this differ from studying in school? My husband's great aunt, a former school principal who raised her four girls alone after her husband passed away, said, "It's not what you know, it's knowing where to find what you need to know." I agree.

The purpose of education is to expose us to a broad base of knowledge so we can better work in our chosen fields. And yes, I can persue my passion without a 4 year degree, it's just that it's getting harder and harder to do the work that I like doing without the credentials of a four year degree. There also is the significant pay difference. I'd like to retire someday and dedicate all my time to community service work!

Thanks Terry for taking the time to respond to me and explore this a bit more. I used to work as a coach. I understand the value of questions, and taking the time to answer questions.

I really loved the process you took your daughter through at the time of her graduation. At some point you must have gone through a similar process. I'd love to hear more about that sometime.

This is going to be really hard for me, but, I think, worthwhile.

Grandma Lise

Hey Terry,

1) Getting my friend through her cancer treatment - (I knew it was going to be hard, but not this hard; she developed a serious complication three days ago). 

2) Becoming a client of the Division of Vocational Rehabilitation so I can get help with the tuition and book costs.

My goal is to start taking classes at the Community College Winter Quarter. 

I used to whine about it taking 10 years to get my degree because I can only take two classes a quarter. 

That was 20 years ago.   

I know what you mean about wanting to know what makes people tick. It's my second favorite thing to think about. My first is figuring out how to support people in moving forward in their lives.

I've made a lot of progress in my own life in the last five years. I have wonderful friends who are healthy and happy. I am working in two healthy work environments with people that I genuinely like and respect. Now if I can just continue doing what I enjoy and make more money, life will be even better. 

It's funny. I'll probably get a degree in psychology then set up a coaching practice. Though I must say, the reason I quit coaching was because I always took on difficult clients and I was way too nice...sigh. That was 10 years ago. Hopefully, I've gotten tougher since then.

I enjoy art - (I belong to an art journaling group) - but writing has always been easier. My mom is the same way. She's able to draw and paint, but stopped when I was young. I asked her recently why and she explained that she could never get past the challenge of composition. At that moment, I realized I struggle with composition too.

I, like my mother, can copy what I see almost exactly, but that's not very creative, so I rarely draw and have done almost nothing to develop that skill. I wish I could hold and move images around in my mind. I've been told that very few people can do that.

I've been meaning to ask Terry, what kind of art do you enjoy? 

Thanks for all your supportive questions and willingness to share stories from your own life Terry. I really appreciate it. Hearing parts of people's stories is how I learn. 

Grandma Lise

Hey Terry,

Oh my gosh Terry, your paintings are fabulous. I can really see why you've continued all these years. I was immediately drawn to bridge on kirkway, birthday dog - (my favorite), owl and fish - (interesting texture), portrait in orange - (I really like it; had to look at it a couple of times), and red bear. The photography was fun. And the mosaic structures are beautiful.

Do you belong to an art group in your community? And how are you able to create the time to do your art?

Art played a role in my healing process. I'd struggled with grief for many years. I don't know how or why, but the opportunity to do art again and the relationships I formed in the art community helped me to shed my anger. In a sense, art restored me. Writing is my current need which is funny because I've done very little writing in the last ten years. Suddenly, I just had a need to write again. I have no idea where this will lead. Hopefully, it will help me lose weight. I don't think about food when I'm writing!

I so appreciate all the support I've recieved here in the last week. When I entered into my adult years, I had a lot of problems to overcome. That's not to say that I don't have a few to work through still but at least now I don't feel so overwhelmed. That's a good feeling.

There were a number of reasons why I stopped coaching. The biggest reasons were that I had two major deficits: I didn't have a degree or professional background - (it's not necessary, but most coaches do and it helps) - and all of my prior experience was volunteer, not workplace related. Now that I have 10 years of work experience, I feel I'd be better prepared to assist clients with workplace issues. The formal training in psychology feels like the last piece to get into place. I'm interested in studying psychology as it relates to healthy, resilient individuals too.

Grandma Lise

Thanks Vicki,

For you to have stayed in your chosen field for fifteen years tells me that it is a good fit for you.

It's possible I could make it work for me too, but I'm not sure. I have a lot of difficulty retaining information on how to use the various computer programs. A full time job with benefits would be preferable. If I give up on my dream to go back to school, that is what I would do.

To advance, computer skills are central, not just people skills. Efficiency is also important. Vicki, I'm curious. What skills and tasks does your current job demand of you? Also, do you prefer fast, average, or slow paced work environments?

Grandma Lise

Thanks Terry,

Am heading to the Division of Vocational Rehabilitation in two hours. I totally forgot that today is one of the intake days.

Grandma Lise

Hi Grandma Lise,

I used to prefer fast paced environments when I was younger. Living by the seat of my pants was a rush and it made the days go faster. Now I prefer laid back and easy going. I worked for a company for 9 years where I had a horrendous commute. I was laid off last year and had a bit of a vacation and then took a job that was only 5 miles from my house. I felt like I was working in a blender because even though it was a nice office, the people I worked for were so disorganized that everything was a fire and it was just really difficult to handle. I left that job and took another position with the company I had been with for 9 years. The commute still sucks, but it was like I never left and the department I am in is full of great people. So we'll see.

I work with some of the office packages regularly, word, excel, powerpoint. Those programs are standard office, but I don't do it every minute of the day. There is a great group of Administrators in this building who are willing to share tips and answer questions.

I have a retention issue as well, but if I can not remember, I just ask. I can hardly remember what I had for breakfast this morning. lol 

What technology and software are you having difficulty with? I am happy to help you via email or walk you through some things on the phone if you like?

Take care and stay in touch!!

Vicki M