Hospital Refuses to Administer ETC

By BiPoPastor Thursday, November 20, 2008

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Forgive me if part of this posting is a bit redundant. A good friend's wife burned their house down in a failed suicide attempt. Their insurance company is going to cover the loss (thank God). His wife is in the local behavorial hospital, and was due to have ECT treatments in a day or two. However, since they don't have health insurance, the hospital is refusing this treatment, and they don't have the cash to cover it.

My question: Is there anything they can do. She is in serious trouble mentally, and this might be just what she needs. (I've had four ETC sessions, with each helping me considerably.)

Thanks!

Still Kickin'

Comments (9) | Add comment

Lucyfur

11/20/08 9:13pm

Pretty bad deal there. Don't know that there is much to be done though. I just know the ECT stuff is pretty expensive cause there are several of them and you get them for a lot of weeks so the price can go pretty high without insurance. They aren't routinely done. Kinda the thing of last resort sorta or major bad time thing. Hospital just wanting to make sure they get paid, that's all. Has your friend checked to see if wife could get medicaid or something? Maybe medicaid if they can get it would pay for the treatments. Course, that is if the hospital accepts medicaid, do they?

HeyJude

11/20/08 9:37pm

Winston...Administering ECTs is VERY controversial. Even many insurance companies will NOT pay for ECTs. Such was the case for me. We were left with some pretty expensive hospital bills.

Your friend's wife will likely have to go without the treatments. Sad. Medical coverage here in the U.S. is in dire straits. If your friend had Medicaid, her needs would be met. Unfortunately, many of us are not treated or have horrendous hospital bills that we cannot afford.

Sorry I cannot offer any encouraging words, but that's just the way it is. Hope your friend's wife finds resolution and is able to get the treatments.

Judy

BiPoPastor

11/24/08 5:37pm

Thank you, Judy. All I can say is that the four sessions of ECT treatments helped me a lot. I really feel that this woman would benefit, but there is that $$ issue. The hospital released her, and she is at her sister-in-law's trailer being watched around the clock. She is NOT better, and I am worried. The hospital has agreed to do each treatment for $1000, which is about 2/3 of the normal charge, but for them it might as well be a million $.

Thanks again, Judy.

peace,

wcsSr

ctrygirl

1/ 8/09 9:34am

I am so sorry to hear that your friend is having such a situation getting the help she needs. I have one suggestion that i didn't read about on here and DO NOT KNOW IF IT APPLIES for M.Illness.....but my sister in law (who is now deceased) had to go to the hospital and was "brain dead" by the time she got there, but they tried to revive or see if it was just a deep coma for 2 days, then we had to decide on the outcome...NOT a situation anyone wants to be in,,,,,but to add to it she had NO insurance and we felt they were pushing us to pull the plug so that the expense wasn't accumulating, however she was showing signs of some kind of changes going on in the brain wave scans.....but i digress...her medical power of attorney applied for what they called a "charity case" which allowed her to continue to get treatment even though she had NO insurance.....possibly the hospital would have that for your friend IF their income is low enough to qualify...just a thought, i know none of us want to accept charity yet when it comes to life or death situations, or something that could SAVE a life then no shame should be associated with it, for everyone would do the same were it someone they loved in order to get them treatment...but I've never had ECT and don't know how it works in the M.Illness portion of the hospital but sure worth an effort to try IF that is the path she wants to go....personally I fear that but that is just my paranoria and my ridiculous stunt of watching One flew over the Cuckoos nest years ago...KNOW there have been MAJOR improvements but it still sticks with me.....however if it is what will mak her better i don't see how they can turn her down...thought the hospitals had a policy to treat EVERYONE no matter insurance or not and heck she could make payments esp if they can reduce the cost!! I don't know how many you have to have, or how any of the ECT works but I am so sorry to hear that she is suffering and those taking an oath to help heal others aren't complying to that oath....
I will be praying and sending positive energy your way my friend, keep the faith, perhaps they will have a charity case situation, or perhaps someone with a HEART will help out.....I know how hard it is without insurance first hand!!

Here's to hoping to find a solution......sounds like she sure has a great friend in you and support group that is VITAL!! I admire you for being so helpful and such a great friend to her......let us know how it turns out please.

TAKE CARE
ctrygirl

BiPoPastor

1/12/09 10:43pm

Ctrygirl;

Thanks for the comments. The "charity case" example might be a possibility, although I think they might have written off the ECT. She is acting better, but still under 24 hour watch at home, and I can tell by talking with her that she hasn't quite "healed". For example, she can talk about the fire, new house, etc, without any remorse. They were able to claim their homeowner's insurance, and their new house if nearly done.

Re: ETC ... my experience has been very good. I had two treatments nearly 2-1/2 yrs ago. It seemed to just "reset my clock" so to speak. Luckily 2 at a time served me well, because after the 2nd session, I was scared to death about going for a third. It is hard to explain, but it was like I felt another session wouldd kill me. Of course that is silly, but it's how I felt.

Sorry about the late response. I had surgery two days after Christmas on my right foot. I have Degenerative Joint and Disc Disease, and the longer I live, the more problems I'll have. The big toe joint on my right foot had to be fused. It involved cutting the joint smooth, putting it back together, and screw it in an "X" shape. The incsion is about 5 inches, and the whole thing was fairly painless. I had a nerve block, and sone med called Twilight", kind of an amnesia drug. Recovery was instant, so when I woke up, I simply left. I now ha e to wear a big "air cast" 24/7 for 5-6 weeks, to make sure it heals correctly.

I wander ... my point of this meander of words is that the pain killers they gave me (Vicadin) reacted with my psycho meds, and the result was 2-3 daays of hallucinations. (Years ago I would have enjoyed it .. I'm just too old now)

Any way, I hope to keep up a little better with this blog and my blog (http://www.bipolarpastor.blogspot.com

Pease and joy,

Your e'friend

Winston

BiPoPastor

1/12/09 10:45pm

oops ... my blog address is: http://hidingbehindthepulpit.blogspot.com

ctrygirl

1/13/09 9:17am

Oh my sounds like you have really been through it honey, I sure hope that the foot heals quickly and painlessly...

YEah I have hallucinations DAILY and have for many years used to thinnk it was what everyone saw (when younger that is) of people just walking about, and some scary ones where they TALKED TO ME (i simply held hands over ears and kept chanting you're not real, you're not real) but i've had this since i can remember!!!

and I hear voices on a DAILY basis, sometimes i hear only one word, others sentences and others sound like directions, I've seen people in the woods as we four wheel that AREN"T there, I've also had sensations of being touched or "tagged" as i like to put it, and very very odd skin sensations...so i know what you mean about the hallucinations/delusions...

but my pdoc DID tell me that there are some who just NEVER get past or stop having the hallucinations (i and he have talked and think it is partly because i went so long to get diagnosed and on some kind of med POSSIBLY ...for i refused to see pdoc for years even though MD asked me to finally convinced me though had to get that image out of my head of them coming in white coats to cart me away basically I KNOW THAT IS SILLY but it was and sorta still IS a fear of mine, have loads of those with paranoria too and 7 other m.illnesses to be honest), for trust me he is a wonderful man and has worked with me to adjust meds, to change meds, to find an answer and it never EVER goes away, most times i'm able to just look away and they are gone...others well like the scary one, didn't go away at first look away but was STILL THERE (middle of the night, no one up but me, sent me WAY manic searching the house to assure no one was in the house for SOOOO REAL LOOKING)

....but yeah me too on the TOOOO OLD thing tehee...but i've learned to live with it, had it since a kid...actually even have this WEIRD way WEIRD thing where sometimes i touch things and can see who held it last as if i were in FIRST PERSON (as if i were them dont see their face just what is ahead of them like through their eyes FREAKY) and can see (those around me say it is almost trance like state and i don't hear them when talking to me...but this is ALWAYS older tools or equipment or antiques or sometimes just toys and such...it is spooky sometimes for i don't realize it till the "session of vision" is over and it is utterly mind boggling)

but anyway, I've learned to just ignore those walking about that i see others dont...and i gauge that by their reactions (i look at their face and if not responding to what i'm seeing i just act as if i don't see it either and boom gone!! ONe specifically scarey one was middle of th night....for i sleep VERY VERY LITTLE.....unfortunately...but anyway TWO people on my COUCH!!!!!!!!! (talking to one another and i couldn't hear what they were saying, i turned away looked back and POOF GONE!!! ) talk about some wild thoughts there..geez...

but i just deal with that sometimes is harder than others but i do know they are hallucinations and that is the difference between those of us like you and i that can discern.....it is sad to think of those that really can't do that...just CAN"T not that they don't want to..

but i digress as is my way tehee..sorry...

I am glad tohear the ECT helped you...it eases my mind in case i ever need such a thing, but i hope that there would be MANY alternatives for it....before i'd comply....but it sounds like it got youback on track and that is great dear, I really want you to know that it eased my mind a bit to know that it does help some and that it isn't straight from the movies like you see...they REALLLY shouldn't do that for people that might need it well, like me at times when tactile BIG TIME rapid cycler and mixed mooder.....well, we would be LESS conducive to even try or let them THINK of doing ECT due to that kind of false image...i do know its come a LONG way from the days of old thank the lord for that!!

I certainly hope that the charity case situation stays with you for i know when my husbands sister was deemed brain dead and they had to decide to unplug her...horrid horrid...and just last december...well, she had little if near to nothing insurance and the hospital is the one that let us know about charity cases and that all hospitals have a quota (according to them, not sure if just trying to ease the moment or if true) where they take on charity cases ...but word of warning if they know that ahead of time, well they aren't so conducive, but even I had to have such a situation, had NO insurance and a kidney stone that needed out like NOW>..and well I paid what i could and the rest they put down as charity case which was a blessing, God does work in mysterious ways and is always with us that is for sure...

I sure hope your foot gets better...believe it or not i too have degenerative disc disease and mine is mostly focused in the spinal area which scares me to pieces but well, i will deal with that as it comes and know it will, but my faith and confidence in the Lord keeps me knowing that "this too shall pass" and that "he is always with me" and with that kind of partner who can loose??? Now don't get me wrong i know that we don't always get answered prayers but iknow he is in charge and watching over his lambs...

I plan on going to your blog...love to see it....anxious to read it...

How does one go about getting a blog??? I would love to have a website to help those in need of encouragement and just venting out their issues of bp and other mental illnesses...I have a masters degree in education (but can't work...and now on disability after a COMPLETE breakdown at school after trying for so long to contain the beast within, IT GOT OUT and took me down with it big time, just now starting to recover to the point i can feel i'm on the right track and that has been 6 years ago!!!)

but anyway, love to have one myself...just curious, not sure anyone would even want to read it tehee..but i'd love to utilize it as a coping skill for myself...i know writing is a BIGGIE for me...along with art of all kinds, beekeeping, picture taking, journaling, MUSIC, and reading the BIBLE most of all....yoga is also good for the body, i don't mean the bend you in half kind teheee..but the relaxation kind...if you haven't tried it you should, there are different levels ...YET WAIT till the foot is healed!!!!

Well, wishing you and your friend the best....hope all goes well with her and she continues to get better , have they tried a MOOD stablizer with her?? changed her meds??? done anything to pull her out of the state she is in besides refuse her help????I sure hope she has a pdoc and therapist ( i feel they are a BIG key to our ability to cope), or a support group.....DUH she has YOU!!! that is precious to her and her family i am SURE>...

Well didn't mean to write a book, take care Winston and GOOD to hear from you again, although bad situation....I plan on hitting that blog site next!!

TAKE CARE and keep spreading the WORD this world sure needs it...

"so shines a good deed in a weary weary world" DAHL

take care friend

ctrygirl

jlhbpmn76

6/10/09 8:19pm

My aunt is a psychiatric nurse in Milwaukee and works at the VA Hospital there. I tried ECT when I was hospitalized in 2003 and had three treatments and had "patient's remorse" almost immediately thereafter. When you induce a grand mal seizure by means of 140 volts surging through your cranium, you are going to suffer SERIOUS and LASTING damage! Furthermore, most people I have known (myself included) who have consented to ECT treatment, while presumed to be competent when giving such consent, are usually either not entirely competent or are not fully informed. In my case, it was the latter (not fully informed about the risks). And given that I was in the hospital in the adult mental health unit, I probably wasn't entirely competent either by virtue of the fact that I was there. I know this sounds pejorative and I don't mean it to be taken as such.

My aunt was absolutely LIVID with me AND the doctors that administered the ECT treatments. If you do the research, you will find that research has consistently shown that people who undergo ECT have a ridiculously high relapse rate (I read in a recent article that it is almost 100 percent!) which is why so many ECT patients have to go back again and again and again.

While ECT may very well benefit some individuals (I have seen no evidence of it personally, but I suppose everyone's chemistry is different), I have very little faith in it and believe it is an outmoded, outdated, ineffective, and dangerous treatment option with virtually NO medical value whatsoever.

Just my two pesos on the matter.

JLH

BiPoPastor

6/11/09 10:37am

I have had ECT four times and will have it again when it becomes necessary. I realize that the results could be different from person to person, but in my case ECT was a great experience. For me it did what it was supposed to do.

Hospital Refuses to Administer ETC

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