John,
I've been thinking about your post all day. I've concluded that you've seen a video of my life and perhaps we've had a 'Spock mind merge'. Couldn't have put together a better wish list.
For many, varied, and important reasons, I think I'm here for the duration. However, I've decided to send an Angel on a search for the perfect person you need. When we have love in our life, it makes every day so good. To know we are accepted and loved, just as we are, is quite a Gift.
Keep your eyes open, God will send her to you.
Margaret
John,
Used your mcmanweb email today and it got sent back. It said the mailbox is unavailable. Thought you'd want to know.
Margaret
I have bipolar disorder and I completely agree with you John--there are no good excuses for violent behaviour--never, ever, ever!
It really angers me when people use bipolar disorder as an excuse for bad behaviour. There is already enough stigma associated with mental illnesses like bipolar in the community. These people are doing us all a disservice when they use bipolar as an excuse to abuse others.
Deborah, Eric, depressionobessission and anyone else -
I say it with a REBEL YELL
I agree.. no excuses. STOMP OUT STIGMA
STOMP OUT ABUSERS (or at least get them professional help - within your realm of safety)
Enough stigma already. Enough burden trying to learn and work on relationships to use mood or mental illness as an excuse. You are more able to help if you are not suffering under abusive behaviors.
There is a chic at work that claims she is bi-polar. I don't believe that she is. I do believe that she has anger management problems that she calls bi-polar. Like it lets her off the hook for her behavior. I am bipolar and have never gotten angry at my co workers, clients, bosses. Never. Just makes me want to go around telling everyone I work to call her on her stuff. But I won't.
Yikes, I couldn't imagine a worse thing for me than living with another person with bipolar. I need someone who is on an even keel when I'm cycling--not someone who joins me in the episode.
A person who does not experience the bipolar mood swings can help the person who is having an episode realize that he/she is over-reacting to a situation, for example (one of my common symptoms).
I, too, was uneasy with John's suggestion of being with another bipolar. But to depend on a normal to take care of me when I cycle sounds codependent. Granted, it would be difficult. Perhaps John is saying he's looking for a soul mate- someone who understands him- as they say, "someone like me." Either way, the main ingredient has to be love, not dependency.
In my experience, I have never heard anyone discuss emotional safety for a bipolar. We're often depicted as dangerous and out-of-control, with a potential to harm others-- e.g., the "crazed man" who makes newspaper headlines when he's tasered by the police. Normals look at how they can be safe from us. I thought it was brilliant to consider "the flip side."
Jo, I consider myself "normal" with a mental disorder. My husband has to learn how to deal with that as I have to learn how to deal with his heart disease. We're both "normal", but doesn't eveyone have some issue in life to deal with & I don't consider it "co-dependent" when I help him make better lifestyle choices for his "disorder" or when he steers me in perhaps a different direction when I go into my over-reactions, which is part of my disorder.
Anyway, enjoyed your remarks as they definitely were thought-provoking for me.
To all,
I suppose if being in a relationship such as marriage makes you an expert in that area, then I guess I qualify to be an expert in the area of a bipolar being married to a bipolar. Yikes, part of me hates calling myself a bipolar; it is like that defines my entire being; I AM A BIPOLAR; is that anything like saying I AM A CANCER?
Anyway, I am diagnosed with bipolar and I was married to a person with bipolar. I can only speak to my personal experience with it, but all I can say is, it was hell, along with some good moments sprinkled in here and there.
If things go well, and neither one of you cycles when the other one is, then you can give it a go and even enjoy each other to the max. One of you can take care of business while the other one goes off into the world that only a person with bipolar can go into - often a psychotic state of being, immersed totally into a world of fantasy and other-worldliness (mania) or deep into the trenches (depression).
If things don't go so well, and you both cycle at the same time, god help you. If one of you is so manic, that the only thing you can think about is your next cigarette or what "toy" you are going to pick up at the local Salvation Army, then someone needs to be there to pay the bills, to make sure the house doesn't burn down, to put groceries on the table, to do a bare minimum of cleaning and, yes, to even work. Unless you are fortunate enough to both be on disability, one of you needs to make sure to provide for all of the above things. If you are both in the throes of mania and/or depression, what happens to all the every day things, which require someone to be present in ther here and now?
Once, when both my husband and I cycled at the same time, we lost our home and very nearly lost our child. If my parents hadn't stepped in, I shudder to think where my child might be today. Most of the time, I was able to "rise above it all" and come back to a semblance of normality, for the sake of my child. Bill would continue on being manic, and I would somehow manage to crawl out of my depression and take care of things. That one time when we nearly lost Erik, well it scared me to the very core of my being, and I will never allow something like that to happen again. My child is my world to me. That one time, when Bill was psychotic with mania and I was psychotic with depression, we lost everything BUT our child. And I only have my parents to thank for the fact that we did not lose our child.
Of course, one could argue that you could be diagnosed with bipolar and be married to someone diagnosed with bipolar and just refrain from having children. This is definitely a sane choice. If both of you cycle at the same time, then you are only responsible for yourselves. Still, I have seen friends lose everything they built together, when they cycled together, and I just don't know how many times you can keep doing that before enough is enough.
My husband and I tried. Most of the time, one or the other of us was fine, so it worked, at least for that period of time. The toll it took on the person who was not cycling was immense. Erik and I had to live in a separate home from Bill, because when Bill got manic, he was a walking fire hazard. He smoked cigarettes incessantly, lit candles everywhere, never bathed or cleaned up after himself and bought little toys as his primary passtime. He also became very scary in that he would threaten to hit us, going so far as to put his fist up in our faces, and then stopping short of hitting us. Then he would laugh maniacally, like it was a great joke.
When I was depressed, it would permeate the very atmosphere of our home. It was like a dark cloud hovering over Bill and Erik, and they lived in fear of me trying to commit suicide. They had to watch me every day and monitor my medication usage, trying to ensure that I would not take an overdose and kill myself. To this day, my child does not trust anyone but himself, because I caused him to lose his trust in people when I tried (and nearly succeede) to kill myself. Imagine how it would have been if Bill had been in a manic or depressive episode of his own at the same time. As I said, this did happen once, and I have told you the outcome of that.
The fear of a fire and the constant threat of violence were, as I said, enough to cause my son and I to have our own place. Still, Bill and I remained married until the day he died. When he was good, he was oh so good. He was a charmer, the life of the party, always with a good story to tell and very sociable. He was kind, empathetic and understanding. He was brilliant, witty and humorous. When he was not cycling, he was my soulmate. We were connected as one. When he or I was cycling, we were worlds apart - never coming together.
I think you have to ask yourself, before you engage in a serious relationship with someone who has bipolar (and you have bipolar), what are you willing to handle every day? And not just for the short term, but for the long term, day in and day out, cycle after cycle. Are you strong enough to bear the hard times when either your partner is not well, and you have to be the rock, or when both of you are not well, and no one can be or is willing to be the solid, stable persona. And then there is the other side to it all: when you are cycling, do you feel safe enough with your significant other to "let yourself go" into the world of mania and/or depression, while he or she "takes care of" you?
Again, if being in a situation makes you an expert on the situation, then I am an expert. My husband is now dead; he died from a combination of COPD and psychotic mania. I don't know if I would ever have gotten a divorce if he had remained alive. I probably would have, as we had not lived together for seven years, when he died. We had some very unforgettable times together and I will cherish them forever. We also had some very awful times and, unfortunately, I will never be able to forget those times. Was it worth it? I can't really say. My son is forever changed because of the experience of livng with two parents with bipolar. I am forever changed in that I am very skeptical about getting into another relationship with a man.
Now to the million dollar question. Would I do it again? To the extent that I could have my child, I would do it again. For the sake of the rest of it? No, I would not do it again. It was too frightening to not have emotional stability as a constant in my relationship. It was too traumatic to have to live in fear for my basic needs from day to day. Yes, I would allow myself to have a friendship with a person who has bipolar. But to the extent that I had any control over my feelings of love, I would not allow myself to love another person with bipolar. When all is said and done, it was just too hard to live that way, day in and day out, year in and year out. I finally just couldn't take it anymore. I was beaten down. I loved my husband more than anyone I have ever known, but love was not enough. You need some basic feelings of stability about your every day well being, and I never knew when that was going to change - either because of myself or because of my husband. The combination was very unstable. Of course, no one knows who is going to remain stable or who is not going to - anyone can go off the deep end for some good reason or another. Still, if you go into the relationship knowing full well that your partner is going to have periods of instability, then you are knowingly setting yourself up for uncertain times. For me, it is just not worth it do it again.
Those are my personal thoughts and experinces. Everyone is entitled to their own thoughts and experiences. If you have found someone with bipolar who has really caught your eye and your heart, I wish you well. Perhaps your experience will not be like mine. We can certainly hope . . . .
Kay
I have been with my husband for 3 years now and I have to say that out of those 3 years about 2 and a half of them have been hell. I was able to relate to so many of those things said in your message. I have know that I was bipolar since I was in the 10th grade, I am 21 now. My husband is 35. I love him more than I have ever loved anyone in my life. After 3 years I just found out yesterday that he is bipolar. He has know this whole time and he has never told me. I felt like that was the ultimate deception to me. I told him I was bipolar when we met, because I did not want my actions at times to be a surprise. I have spent the past 3 years of my life thinking I was crazy. Every time I tried to get on medicine he would make me stop taking it and call me a pill popper. He would tell me that I don't have bipolar I am just dealing with life. The other day he decided to look up some information about bipolar and I guess it just clicked in his head that I am telling him the truth. I always thought that he had something and even asked him to go get checked out but he would never do it. He has never been on meds and thought that by telling me the things he did he was impowering me to be a better person and not use bipolar as a cruch.... he was trying to turn me into him. I told him it is not a cruch it is who he is and he needs to accept it and get help. I mean when ever I cycled he did it was like we triggered each other. When I say the past 2 and a half years have been hell that is what I mean. He made it to the point of calling me out of my name, yelling at me, grabbing me, chocking me, slapping me, and throwing me around. That is bad enough in itself but for someone like me who has to have control of any situation I am in made it much harder. I felt alone and controled. He would tell me I control him and he just can't see how he controls me, but he controled my movements by holding me down not letting me go pushing me pulling me. I had no control over my own body functions. At a certain point I stopped even being able to talk. I didn't know what to say. After trying to deal with myself and my husband for all of this time I thought I have to get out and I cheated on him. I thought it was my way out. It wasn't. When things are good between us it is so good. We are soul mates we are each others everything, but when things are bad they are so bad it makes me want to run away and never look back. I am in fear of him because I never know when he is going to change and I never know what he will do when he does. The thing that makes it even worse is that he drinks very heavily. My husband is the smartest, most amazing minded person I have ever know. I wish we could communicate. We have been spending the last 3 months trying to fix our relationship, but yesterday after he blew up on me, he told me he is bipolar and he has know since the early 90's. That was something i realy could not figure out how to handle. I mean shouldn't I have the right to choose from the beggining if being with a bipolar person is something that I can handle. He is not into getting help and I need to get away from him......... only problem is I don't know how and when I am with him he makes me not want to anymore...............
nicki
Hey John,
I was reading over your article, again, as it really got me to thinking.
You said your bottom line in a relationship is "emotional safety". I hope you read my previous post about my experience being in a significant relationship (in my case, married) with a person who has bipolar. You said that you did not want a relationship with a "normal" person because they could probably not provide you with the "emotional safety" you longed for.
I have actually had two marriages - one to a person without bipolar and one to a person with bipolar. My first marrige ended in divorce - no kids, thank god, and my first husband did not have bipolar. My second marriage ended in death, and my deceased husband had bipolar.
If you are seeking emotional safety, I am concerned that you may not find it in a person with bipolar - at least not in any kind of permanent way. When my second husband was in the midst of a psychotic episode, the last thing on his mind was my emotional safety. In fact, I would venture to say that he could not or would not look after his own emotional safety, when experiencing mania or depression, much less provide me with any kind of emotional safety.
If we were both symptomatic, it was like two life rafts adrift at sea - both of us clinging on to life, but very much apart from each other and only able or willing to care for ourselves, not someone else. When this happened, we very nearly lost our child. I shudder to think what might have happend if my parents had not intervened.
When I was feeling "normal" and my husband was having psychotic symptoms, I would try to reach out to him and understand. He would rebuke all of my efforts and just push me aside. He would not or could not accept any kind of loving gesture from me. He was so caught up in his fantasy world, that that the only things that mattered to him were his next cigarette, his next bite to eat, or the next toy he could buy to add to a growing pile of seemingly mismatched toys. When he did feel like "making love", it was purely a physical thing - more a matter of him controlling me and using me for his sexual release. There was no emotional connection in it for him.
When I was having problems with depression, but my husband was having "normal" emotions, he was not at all empathetic about my situation. I was always surprised about that, because I thought that he, above everyone else, would be able to understand where I was coming from. Quite to the contrary, he would become angry at me and tell me to stop behaving the way I was and just get up and start doing things. I later found out that his anger was rooted in his inability to do anything to get me out of my depression. He felt hopeless and helpless when it came to pulling me out of it. He reacted with anger rather than with love and compassion.
I hope that this is helpful to you, as you open yourself up to the possibilities of a new relationship. It has been more than two years since my husband died, and I am nowhere near ready to face the prospect of a relationship with another man. And if and when I do, it will probably not be with another man who has bipolar disorder. Although my first husband and I divorced, it wasn't because he was not empathetic to me and my feelings. Rather, we grew apart and developed interests in other things that each one of us did not share in common with the other. Was it the fact that he didn't have bipolar and I did? To be honest, we never talked about that, so I don't really know. He did stick by me through an attempted suicide attempt and a few hospitalizations for depression. In fact, it was my idea to get a divorce, not the other way around. We just grew apart. There was no emotional drama or fanfare.
Best of luck to you in the dating and relationship world. In case you haven't noticed, I think that there is a very nice woman on this forum who is very interested in you. Who knows what the possibilities might be?
Kay
Hello John,
You know, it doesn't have to be that a "normal" person will judge you or analyze your every move, if you are in a relationship with her. My first husband was extremely supportive of me and my cycles. He did not want to leave the relationship; I did. He took the time to learn about bipolar and supported me when I was not doing well. He was very loving, and he was not abusive in any way; the only thing that made us split was the fact that we had grown apart; I wanted to make something out of my life, and he was content to leave things the way they were.
You mentioned that you and your second wife never cycled together. That was a very fortunate thing indeed. If you ever find yourself with someone who is bipolar, and the two of you cycle together, I can only wish you two the best of luck. Hopefully, you will have some kind of support system in place to use as a back-up plan, in the event the two of you cycle at the same time. If not, the cold reality of the matter is that you stand to lose everything you have worked so hard for. My husband and I lose everything on a couple of occasions, and I finally realized I had to get my own place, so that I would not lose everything if he got psychotic again. For my part, my family was in place as a support system if anything happened to me.
It is great that your second wife (who had bipolar) was able to be compassionate and understanding of your bipolar cycles. I only wish the same had been true about my second husband. He did not understand anything, and he always harped at me to get myself out of my depression and get back to the land of the living. He became extremely angry when I tried to commit suicide. He yelled at me and he told me not to go to a doctor because they wouldn't be able to help me. I spent the next year having problems with my mind and my body, caused from the overdose of pills I had taken. I would have night sweats and cold chills and I felt like I was constantly stoned on some kind of drug. Perhaps if I had been encouraged to go see a doctor, I would not have needed to suffer this way. And then there was intimacy, or lack thereof. Sex became a ritualistic control fest, designed for my husband's satisfaction, alone, and there was absolutely no intimacy involved. For two people who started out as soulmates, this was a rude awakening for me. It did something negative to me, that I was never able to re-connect with my husband in an intimate way. Our relationship was ruined because of the way he treated me when he was manic. Oh yes, I abolutely forgave my husband; I loved him so much. I just could not get certain images out of my brain, and it cost me my relationship.
If I do have another long-term relationship, it will not be with someone who has bipolar. I am much too gun-shy after what has happened to me. Worse than any other thing I have mentioned, is the fact that my husband died partially because of his manic psychosis. He had COPD and was not able or willing to follow his doctor's directions to take oxygen every day. If he had not been bipolar, he would probably still be alive today, and I would not find myself a widow at the young age of 51.
But hey, John, more power to you if you can find a soulmate in another person with bipolar. You would definitely think that this person would be more empathetic because of her own experience with bipolar. It intuitively makes sense. My reality of it, however, did not jibe with any form of intuitive sense, and I found myself penniless, with only the clothes on my son's and my backs, after one of Bill's manic episodes, combined with my psychotic depression.
I hope this does not happen to you.
Kay
Never and I repeat never tolerate abuse from anyone. Get out and don't look back.
I think the reasons bipolar people attract is the empathy we get from the other of knowing and understanding the feelings associated with the illness.
You will never hear the other tell you to just snap out of it or just plan get over it that you might and usually hear from non-bipolar spouses.
I don't know of any expert that can tell you if your relationship will survive or not, it will have to be a test of time and endurance on both parts.
I will add...you need to think long and hard before saying I do again too what you're willing to put both you and your significant other through. Sometimes marriage is not the way to go.
Hi John,
In any relationship, we need to step into it with Faith.
A good relationship is like two puzzle pieces. One fills the lack/need of the other and the other way around.
You will know when she arrives in your life and asking her or yourself 20 questions, could take the joy out of discovering the wonder of having love in your life again.
The Lord will guide you.
Blessings on your journey,
Margaret
Hello Eric,
I don't mean to be contrary, but what you said about bipolar people always being empathetic and understanding about what you are going through, because of their own personal experience with it - well, it just wasn't true in my case. My husband did not ever empathize with my depressions and, in fact, became very hostile toward me when I was in the midst of a severe depressive episode. I got more understanding and compassion from my first husband, who did not have bipolar or any other kind of mental illness.
Perhaps my experience is an isolated case. I certainly hope that is true. For me, though, I am not willing to take the chance, again, and have everything I had built together with my husband, go down the tubes. I can only go, based on what I have experienced, not what theoretically makes good sense. My reality was that my bipolar husband wanted little or nothing to do with me when I was depressed and he was "normal". You talk about being judged! He screamed at me every day to snap out of it and join the land of the living. When I tried to commit suicide, he became very angry at me and refused to assist me in any way. When he was manic, he would use me for his own personal satisfaction and toss me aside after he got what he wanted.
I would be interested in hearing from others who have actually experienced life with another bipolar person. Have you had a good experience or was it similar to mine?
Again, I only speaking from what I know to be true in my own experience with bipolar to bipolar in a relationship.
Kay
Hi Margaret,
I thought a lot about what you said about relationships being two pieces of a puzzle, in which each person fills a lack or a need of the other one.
While I think this may be true for a great many people, I don't think it is the healthiest way to approach a relationship. The best relationsip I ever had was when I was functioning at 100% and my future significant other was functioning at 100%. When you put the two of us together, you got 200%, not just one half filling out the other half to make a whole.
I did not need, nor did my signficant other need, anyone else in my life to make me complete or whole. I was already whole and having my significant other in my life, just added to an already existing whole. I think when a relationship is put together on a "needs" basis, it is bound to be a set- up for problems, because what happens if the other half cannot give you what you need? In my case, with my second husband, when neither of us could give each other what we needed, we lost everything we had worked so hard to put together.
Just some thought on a very provocative subject. I wish anyone out there who is looking for a relationship, the very best of good luck - whether your partner is a person with bipolar or not. Even in the best of circumstances, a relationship takes a lot of hard work.
Kay
Hi Kay,
Was giving my thoughts of why bipolar people end up with each other. My wife and I are both bipolar, at the present time she is hospitalized and this has been going on the forth week.
I visit twice a day, tell her to hang in there and reassure her everything is going to be all right. I am not telling her to snap out of it nor being anything but supportive. I find it hard as others not really knowing the feelings associated with the illness seem to only put undue pressure on her.
She is in mania and has been for almost three months, the voices she hears, the paranoid delusions that sometimes takes place by the minute become unbearable.
Last Wednesday the shrink decided she was fit to come home even though the treatment counselor and I said not yet. Well they let her sign out and I went through hell and back for three days until she ended up pulling a large kitchen knife and tried to kill me because she thought she heard me say to her father that she had made a threat on the president.
I am not angry or upset with her, but at times I am with the illness and the aka professionals associated with the treatment. So I guess you could say I know and have more understanding of why things are happening the way they have.
Hey Eric,
I say more power to you and your wife, if you can make it together. As you had said earlier, however, even if it is the bipolar disorder that causes your wife to become violent, she must take responsibility for her actions. Does she do this when she is in the middle of one of her psychotic episodes? You are a very kind and understanding person if you can tolerate such things as your wife pulling a knife on you. I couldn't live like that, with the constant fear of being abused or fearing that my husband would start a fire and burn the apartment down. He set many fires and caused extensive damage to an apartment we lived in. He had set other fires as well, one in a swanky hotel he stayed in while attending a national mental health conference. He set another one in his apartment here in Montana (when we were living apart), and the police arrested him and placed him on $50,000.00 bond. He pooh-poohed the incident, saying that there was no danger from the fire, even though big clouds black smoke were coming from the apartment and people upstairs were in danger for their lives.
These were the kinds of things I could not tolerate. I did understand the behavior. I could not condone it, though, living in fear for my daily safety. Oh, and we had a son whose life was also in danger. If nothing else, I owed it to my son to provide for a safer enivironment. One time I woke up during the middle of the night to the smell of what I thought was chicken cooking. When I went down to investigate it, there was a huge bonfire going on outside on our patio. It scare the living bejesus out of me.
Then there were the cars that my husband trashed. He would never take care of any of his cars, and he blew up engines in at least four cars, during the period we were together. He still had to make the payments on them, and this was an extreme financial hardship on us.
I could go on and on. Yes, I empathized with my husband, and I did not stand in judgment of him. I understood that what he was going through was a direct result of the psychotic mania. Still, he never accepted responsibility for his actions - neither while "normal" or while manic. He always had some "yes, but" answer when I spoke to him about his behavior while manic. I was not willing to tolerate that aspect of our life together.
Oh and yes, there was the abuse - or near abuse. He spit on me, dragged me around by my feet, with his feet entwined in mine, he threw my head down onto a concrete floor, and sex became nothing more than a control thing for him. There was absolutely no intimacy involved in sex when he was manic. It was all about his pleasure and his ability to dominate me. This was in stark contrast to the way he made love when he was "normal".
All of this behavior - the spitting and the violence - left me not willing or able to share intimate sex with him. He would always try and not seem to understand when I just couldn't get into it. I forgave him; I just couldn't forget those images in my mind. One other thing - he would act as if he was going to hit me, getting his fist right up into my face and then, just stop short of actually hitting me. He did the same thing to our son. This, I could not and would not tolerate. It was scary as all get-out, and I chose not to live that way. We remained married, but we had different apartments, so that when he became manic, my son and I had our own safe haven in which to retreat.
Because of all these things, I have long since lost any kind of sex drive that I had, and I had a healthy desire for sex prior to this kind of treatment. I do not even look at men as sexual creatures anymore, because of the way I was treated. I see them as power and control freaks, out for their own gain. I know this is an over-generalization, but that is the way I feel. I am doing my level best to ensure that my son does not treat his spouse the way his dad treated me.
Speaking of my son, he lives in fear that he may one day become psychotic. And with good reason - both his mom and dad had (have) biplar disorder. I am periodically reassuring my son that he does not have the disorder, and this is true enough; he is one of the most level-headed and stable young adults I know. He even points out to me when I start becoming depressed and he helps me out to not go further into the darkness of depression. He is the one gift from my marriage that I will always treasure. To the extent that I could have my son again, I would do it all over again with my husband. If this were not possible, I would not ever do it again. It was just too painful, and it led me to live my life in fear of being able to provide for my basic needs.
I usually worked, except for the times when I was hospitalized for depression and/or mania. I never did get Social Security Disability, although many of my friends and family members thought I should apply for it.
Eric - at what point does the awfulness of living with a person with bipolar, who experiences severe mood swings, cause you to say enough is enough? How much more can you take, given your own fragile state of emotional stability? Yes, you are empathetic and a great support to your wife. But what happens when you both cycle at the same time? Who is left to pick up the pieces? I don't believe anyone on this forum has answered my question about this. My husband willingly became homeless, while I went back to live with my folks.
For myself, I have a built-in network, whereby, if I go down the awful road of severe depression/mania, my sisters will take care of my son, while I go through my cycle. If we should lose our apartment, I have it set up to where Erik and I can live with my parents until such time as I can get myself back together. One thing - I am and always have been - very compliant about taking medications. As a result, I don't usually experience the sharp mood swings, such as I did when I was in my 20's and 30's. Growing older has caused my manic and depressive episodes to lose their intensity, with one severe exception. Back in March, 2006, I very nearly succeeded in killing myself with an overdose of my medication. I guess I died on the table three times, before they were able to stabilize me. My poor son asked me what he had done wrong, and it nearly broke my heart. Because of that, I don't think I will ever give in to my feelings of suicide again. I just picture my son in my mind and realized that he had already lost one parent. I need to be around for the long haul.
I have about talked your ear off here. It's just that I feel so strongly about what happened to me, my husband and my son. On the flip side of things - when I was depressed, my husband showed me no empathy or understanding. He would yell at me to get out of bed and tell me to start acting normally. When I tried to commit suicide, he became very angry at me, and he told me not to even try to go to the doctor, because they would not be able to help me. I listened to him and spent the next year of my life, feeling stoned, having night sweats and cold chills each day.
My first husband, who was not bipolar, would have gotten me some help. He was much more compassionate about my problems, and he never even once came close to abusing me.
I will be praying for you and your wife. She has been cycling for quite a while now, and if she is anything like my husband was, she should be getting out of her manic phase and starting to come back down a bit. Then again, I have heard of people who stay up for eight months to a year. Do you know what to do to help your wife come down from her manic high? My husband would have to get arrested for some criminal act and then the jailers would make sure he got psychotropic meds. After a bit of time, he would start coming down and return to his old self. I relished those times with him.
You take good care of yourself and your wife. As I said, you are in my thoughts and prayers.
Kay
Hi Kay,
Your prayers mean a lot. I do have a good support group with other family members but my tendency is to say I'm fine and maybe that's a guy thing.
My wife is the most loving and compassionate person I know and this is like seeing a dr. jeckle/Mr. hide ordeal. The last manic episode was 17 years ago and the depression was 5, so she stays pretty stable most of the time.
I ask god on a regular bases to allow us to switch places and make her ok. At this point he is either not listening or doesn't agree with my idea. I feel most of the time that I have failed her in not protecting her from this. I keep replaying the past events looking for something I should have done differently.
Faith is a good part of any and all relationships. Thanks for bringing that back into focus. We can get so caught up on a person with or without a DX that we forget to know if the person is of similiar spiritual compatability, backgrounds, food likes/dislikes, I hate to say it but it is the little day to day things that sometime wreck relationships.. not that you have to play a 20 ?'s with predetermined answers but you better have a least a little clue about fundementals if you are gonna have anything long term and emotional safe or stimulating.
I dont' want someone just like me Bipolar or not.. boring
but we need to be on the same page about certian likes and dislikes - to even make a go of things.
Faith.. we must take a step out in faith to even learn the basics. bipolar or not bipolar really is not the question I ask. I look for willingness to grow and believe knowledge in many areas are the best tools for humans to grow into a bond.
I really like your puzzle piece analogy.
This may sound mean.. But I'm glad you are a widow. I"m glad your abusive husband is a dead *******.. good times or not.
He abused you.
He abused your trust, your love and your child.
spitting, cussing, dragging, rough sex (unless of course agreeded upon - nothing bad - to my BDSM friends) "fake" fisting what ever excuse you want to
make it ok in your mind they are just that - all just that excuses.
YOU where a victim.@#$%^
NO WAY. NO HOW is a DX of any disorder an excuse to hurt someone else. When a person with schizo, BP, Borderline or any other mood or mental disorder begins to verbally or physically abuse you. GET TO SAFETY. THE BEST very BEST thing you can do for all people and the media and the stigma of mental illness or mood disorders is NOT TO TOLERATE psychotic, dangerous manic or dangerous depressive aggressive behavior.
I"M GLAD.. REPEAT NO TYPO - GLAD the ******* is dead!!!!! God will judge him and I hope he is burning in HELL or rotting in a hole somewhere.
NO one deserves what you endured. You share the horros like you are sharing your soul to warn others..I'm not buying it.. I"m buying it as you are a needed person. A sad needy person.. have mercy on your soul.
If you want pity, I have none, I don't trust your advise on relationships either.
You did not have enough common sense or self esteem to divorce the *******.. or get the marriage invalidated.
I hope your child is getting training on how to break the "needy" person cycle and is not gonna take the "whoa- is me" I must endure at all cost "marriage vow" someday.
People that sensationalize the abuse - with your details only need to be on the Oprah or 60 minutes type specials.
You are in retail.. get out meet someone nice.. with common interest that will treat you with respect - your way or the highway would be a good motto to adopt.
You are only 51- find someone - stop staying in the rut. Even pigs know when to get out of the heat..
Hey Magnolia,
Wow! All I can say is Wow! I must have really struck a raw nerve in you. I am not asking for pity. Far from it. I did get out. I didn't live with my husband after the physical abuse occurred. When my son was five, I took off for Montana and never lived with my husband again. Except for the piece of paper that would have legally terminated the marriage, we were divorced. My husband did not lay a hand on me after the physical abuse occurred. It all happened during a one-week span of time. It was not repeated.
Wow! I mean, wow! You seem to have so much hatred in your heart. I can only wonder where that comes from. In the Christian spirit, I forgave my husband. We are all God's children - good and bad. Yes, I forgave him, but I did not forget what he did. That memory kept me living apart from him until the day he died. What happened to you that you would be so gleeful that someone died? Have you had firsthand experience with this? I am so sorry for the hostililty you harbor within yourself. That hostility will eat you alive, much like a cancer.
I do not feel sorry for myself, and I am not trying to sensationalize what happened to me. It was what it was. If what I have shared can be helpful to someone, that would be fantastic. If not, well, it was definitely good to get it off my chest amongst a group of people who might understand what it was like.
If you really want to read about people who tolerate negative and abusive behavior, go to the message boards of this forum. There, you will find people who are stuck in a dangerous cycle. There you will find the audience for whom your vicious remarks were intended.
It is true that I will not knowingly get into a relationship with a person who has bipolar. This is just simple learning from experience. I am not really interested in meeting "someone nice". I appreciate your concern, but my life is quite full with my son and my work.
And just so you know, my son does not live in the world of the "whoa is me, poor pitiful me" people. He is just about the opposite of that. He does not feel at all sorry for himself. He believes that what he has been through has made him a stronger, wiser person.
I feel the same way about the experience I had with my husband. I would not want to repeat what happened, but now I definitely know what I do NOT want in a relationship. You were mistaken, Magnolia, if you thought I was looking for your pity or if you thought I was feeling sorry for myself. I was simply sharing my own story of life with a person who has bipolar. If it seemed a bit graphic for you - well, that is because it was graphic. Would you prefer it if I sugar-coated my story to protect you and others from knowing about the reality of the situation? I would not sugar-coat my life experience for anyone. The details I gave were descriptive of the experience I had. You can take it or leave it. I was only telling it like it was. I was not on the Oprah show, trying to get attention to sell a story. I was on a forum that consists primarily of people with bipolar, where I would hope people would (attempt to) understand.
Yes, Magnolia, I got out. I didn't make it legal by getting an official divorce, but I left my husband back in 1997. We never lived together after that, because unlike many, I LEARNED from my mistakes and my experience. I did not allow the negative crap to repeat itself over and over. On the other hand, I did not just bale at the first sign of problems. My husband's disorder got worse as he got older. The episodes of violence were not pronounced in the beginning. When they culminated as they did (per my previous description), I got out.
So, Magnolia, while I appreciate your concern, it is not needed. You are preaching to the choir, my dear. I am a firm believer in people getting out of abusive relationships. You and I are, after all, on the same page. Save your preaching for someone who needs it. In the meantime, I will continue to live my life with my world as I know it. Again, if you feel as strongly as your post would indicate, go to the message board on this forum. There are plenty of spouses of people with bipolar who are currently living a life of hell, who might do well, to hear what you have to say.
As surely as you say you are glad that someone is dead, you might have been the murderer.
Peace and harmony to all,
Kay
You can best believe I would have jumped at every defense tactic in the book to get someone like you out of the abusive person's control. Self defensive is legal..
I"m glad your son is free. I don't hate. I"m actually a healer with low tolerance for people that suffer under the guise of loyality to a spouse of mentally ill person. You or no one else can help a mood disorder or mentally ill loved one by tolerating abuse.
Not hating anyone.. just wishing freedom and an awaking for anyone that suffers under the false assumptions that staying is a form of love or assistance to a person with a mental or mood disorder..
No cancer here.. just warnings. GET OUT OF THE HEAT.. please
Hello Magnolia,
You must not have read my previous posts about my husband. You see, I AM out of the heat. My husband died over two years ago, from a combination of COPD and psychotic mania. You got your wish and you didn't even know it. It came a little late, though. In this case, your hind sight was 20-20.
Now, you must feel better, knowing that I am no longer in an abusive relationship. I hadn't been in one for several years prior to my husband dieing. I DID get out - as soon as I could - right after the abuse occurred.
Magnolia, you might want to be careful about what you wish for. It may just come true.
Have a wonderful, violence-free day,
Kay
I've read hours of your long post, as well as others on the days I can't get out - I read.
Again I say I'm glad you are out. I'm glad your son is breaking the cycle. I feel for some many others of bipolar or mood or personality disorder relationships - and the final note still stands -- it takes more love to walk away and be a safe help than to be swept in the furur of the moments of way too much depression or hyper mania or even further past bipolar into a psychotic state which normally the ones most aggressive or in the fight/flight center of their brain and needing perfessional highly trained handling to have the best chance at a safe turnout.
If you where a mother in the woods with two small kids.. it would not do to be loving and feed the kids while you starve to death.. it would be more loving to feed yourself, teach your kids how to feed and up your chances of making it out of the crisis. Feed live for a day.. teach to fish maybe they live a lot longer...
Walking away - going to a local hotel- checking them into the emergency room may sound rough -- but in 1000's of cases it has proved to be the eye opening event.
You can be alone in a crowd - you can be alone in a relationship..so this isn't just about depressionobsession - This is about the other readers/bloggers it is much better to be alone with some control and reduced anxiety - You can still support, care and nurture with Dr/Ms jeckly/hyde out of your safety zone..
Have a plan.. stay out of the heat.. and many authors on relationships and mental health care takers state the same facts.
Remember to get the sunshine during the coming winter months but also avoid tooo much "heat" will help with your mood and outlook as well.
Hello Magnalia,
You talked about cycles. I was puzzled by that because I was never in a cycle. You made it sound like I had endured a lifetime of constant abuse. I did not. I grew up in a very quiet, stable household, in which the closest any of my sisters and I came to abuse, was my mom raising her voice and saying hell to us. I had never encountered abuse until my husband did the spitting, etc. My son is not breaking a cycle. You say you have read my long posts, but I don't think you are comprehending them. Or, actually, I think you are interpreting my words to mean what you want them to.
Your analogy of the woman being in the woods - while it definitely made a point - the old you can feed them all day long, and get rid of their hunger for a day OR you can teach them to fish and get rid of their hunger for a lifetime - it is true, but it is such a worn out cliche. And besides, I don't expect that I will be living in the woods any time soon, so I wonder about the relevancy of your comparison. Talk to me in terms that are real and actually have something to do with day to day living in this world, and then I will listen more attentively.
Oh, you are absolutely correct about one thing. This is not just about depressionobsession. There are a whole host of individuals who read this forum, and who respond to it or just take in what others have to say - or both. I am not sure what your point was in saying that.
John McManamy was touting the possible wonders of being in a relationship with a person with bipolar, and I was simply describing my personal experience with it. It was not a theoretical analogy. It was a fact-based truth and, to the extent that it was useful to someone, then it was a story worth telling. At most, it was a tale to give someone something to think about, if they were considering a relationship with a person who has bipolar. Again, that was just my experience with it. Nothing more, nothing less.
And Magnolia, I can't help but wonder why you are so hell-bent on saying that everyone is totally, 100% responsible for all of their actions and feelings, etc. Have you never been drunk or stoned on drugs, to the point where you did things that you might never have done if you were sober? Have you never fallen in love, in spite of yourself, with your heart dictating who you were attracted to, and not just your rational mind? Have you always been so completely in control of every facet of your being that you have never even once done something a little out of control? If you haven't, then I must say, my hat is off to you. You are probably the only person I know who can make every decision with a completely rational thought process.
Do you take psychotropic medications, Magnolia? Why, the very purpose of medications, is to control our moods - to do what we can't seem to do for ourselves. If we were so much in control of our every waking moment, why would we need medications to help us handle our thought processes and our moods?
Yes, I recall calling the police and having my husband arrested for hitting me in the face, during that one-week period of time. He spent the night in jail, and I took off for my home state the next day. You are absolutely right that something like calling the police or going to a hotel room, can be a life altering event. I didn't need to go to a hotel, that night, because I made sure the police took my husband away from me.
I really hope others are reading what you are writing. As you said, it is not all about depressionobsession. Your advice is well-founded, and I hope it gives someone strength to do what they need to do in a bad situation. Still, I don't think it is so easy that you can tell everyone it is this clear-cut, so black and white. While I never understood how a woman could continue to stay in an abusive relationship, I know that there are many who do it. Who am I to judge what they do or put them down or condemn them? Who am I to say I wish their spouses would rot in hell and that they deserve to die? I am not God! What makes you or me so special that we can wish such an awful fate on ANYONE?
I, too, am glad that I do not live in fear of something violent happening to me. Having a safe haven where you can plop yourself down and know that you will be respected and loved, is a priceless thing to have. Do you have this, Magnolia? Was there ever a time when you did not have this? The intensity of your beliefs leads me to believe that you have firsthand knowledge and experience with this type of thing. Did you break the cycle of abuse? I wonder . . . . . .
Kay
Do you talk as much as you write?? I thought I was a chatty person.
Yes broke the abuse cycle. to answer your question.
am I gonna give details to you. no.
Endured is a good term to use. I like that term.
My term of cycles may be different than your term of cycles. I think up down round about like a roller coaster with sometimes a chance to get off but often time a mania drive like a kid to find yourself right back in line to ride the same roller coaster..
Hard to explain.. but none the less I use the term cycles. repeat errors, repeat misunderstandings, if ya want me to say it I'll say repeat life mistakes while I was being so great in industry and getting two degrees -
It took a couple of full blown breakdowns and a hospitalization for 5 days before I finally would say I had a chronic problem and although my diagnosis was different than my mother's or undiagnoised brothers.. none the less the ugly gene of mental illness was in full swing and in all likely hood be a part of everyday of the rest of my life.
Knowledge is power and learning to tame the beast with meds, diet, exercise and practising whatever other wellness tools you can master are all parts of coexisting in this lifetime
I was recently married back in July to my husband. I suffer from Type 1 diabetes, borderline personality disorder, panic attacks and bipolar disorder,. He has depression and anxiety attacks. Even though we have been together for awhile he is still getting used to my bipolar as I am his depression. It has never went to abusive behavior as it has with these women. Now my mother's previous marriage and current marriage is another story. She was married to an undiagnosed bipolar. He was abusive and a cheater. We did not know until after their marriage had ended that he was bipolar. (My half-brothers have inherited it from him. He's not my father.) Now her current husband has bipolar and is not coming home at all and supposedly is going through a thing. He's never hurt my mother but he's very violent towards others and will not go and get help. He was a different man when she married him but is completely different now. I find it interesting how different her and my relationships are even though there is someone with bipolar disorder in both relationships.
Cherise
Hello Cherise Loe,
I just wanted to send you a post, wishing you and your husband the very best of everything. It sounds like you are off to a good start, and that can be so valuable in establishing a solid foundation to your marriage. You know, everyone's experiences are different and it is probably best if you view your relationship through yours and your husband's eyes. Anything that I or anyone else has gone through may have little to no bearing on whatever you and your hubby are feeling and experiencing.
Still, it is nice to share what you are doing and how it is working for you. It feels so good to know that others have had a successful relationship with someone who has a disability of any kind. It sounds like you and your husband have a lot in common, with a dash of something different in each one of you to make life interesting!
Again, best of everything to you. It is always nice to hear that someone is doing well in their marriage - whether one of the people has a disability or not. A happy marriage is a thing to be treasured - for any person!
Warm thoughts and peace to you,
Kay
I can relate with all you said. I have two failed marriages and fear being emotionally unsafe. My comment is that I have two failed marriages (of which I contributed my part of the failure).
I had not been diagnosed as bipolar when I married my first husband. He was self medicating with alcohol and drugs. I chose to seek help legally, he chose illegally. I was told my life would improve if I simply got rid of him. I believed it and we divorced.
My second husband pursued me through church, my kids, and was totally dishonest with me from the beginning. He left me the final time after 18 months of horror for my two kids and myself.
Since that time, I have been alone and fearful of finding myself in another failed marriage. How do you find someone who can understand you, but is healthy enough to take responsibility for their own baggage and work through difficulties?
Hello Anonymous,
My heart went out to you when I read your post. It can be so sad, but true, that the way we were treated in previous relationships, affects the relationships we find and develop in the future.
I don't have an answer to your question. If I did, I would be one rich woman! Still, I do remain optimistic. Just because I have had two "failed" marriages, does not mean I can't have a successful one. Some people I know have been married and divorced multiple times. I don't think that means all their marriages were failures. I think it means that their marriages succeeded for a finite period of time, rather than being successful over the long haul.
It seems we define a marriage as successful in as much as it lasts a lifetime. I don't necessarily agree with that. My marriage to my first husband was successful - at least for the first few years. Problem was, we just grew apart. There was no violence, no name calling, no child torn between the two of us. It kind of faded away, and we went our separate ways.
You can measure success by the minute, the year, or somewhere in between. I choose to measure it in the smaller increments.
Keep yourself open for possibilities. One thing I have found to be true for myself is that, the more I want something (like a man in a relationship), the more elusive it becomes. The best relationships I have had were those that happened when I was doing well, personally speaking, and was not "looking" for a man. Because I was doing well, I naturally let off an air of confidence and self-assuredness, and I believe my mates were attracted to that confidence. When I was actively looking for a man, it was usually because something was missing in my life. As a result, I am sure I let off a less confident air, which probably was not as attractive as my more confident persona.
In the end, it is probably a good thing to follow your heart and then use the best common sense you can. Also, I think it is important to make sure you both have similar values and life goals. If you follow your gut AND use your head at the same time, I think you increase the chances of a successful relationship. Another important thing is to give the relationship some time. Many unsuspecting spouses find themselves very drawn to people with bipolar, because bipolar people are often very charismatic and sociable people. After time, those characteristics can often be over-shadowed by other traits of the person with bipolar, so you get a more complete picture of the entire person and not just the "honeymoon" vantage point.
So, keep the faith. There are all kinds of people out there, with or without bipolar, who accept responsibility for their "baggage". You just haven't found one of them yet. And hey, don't try so hard. It seems the best things happen to you when you least expect them to.
I wish you the very best,
Kay
Kay, Thank you for your response. I found this group by accident and after reading the responses, I decided to take a chance and put myself out there.
I am in a depressed phase currently so it is difficult for me to appear confident. The story goes like this. In March of this year I was forced into a medical leave of absence by my employer. This was after being through much harrassment and criticism no matter how hard I tried.
Once I went out on medical, things began to spiral out of control. I followed the recommendations of the medical professionals treating both my bipolar and degenerative disc disease. Unfortunately, the professionals could not agree and I have been in limbo since. I have not been able to find another job, am still waiting for approval or denial by long term disability, and even applied for social security disability.
My confidence is pretty much gone and I don't trust my doctors at this point. I am not actively looking for any relationship because I KNOW this is not the best time for me to shine. I was just intrigued by the conversations and wondered what other people had to offer regarding my situation.
It is nice to visit with someone who actually understands the difficulties without automatically assuming the worst.
I've been reasonably fortunate that this is the first time I've been faced with termination. I've always struggled in the work place but have given it my best shot regardless of how it made me feel. I am in total agreement with all the comments regarding verbal or physical abuse. I am seeking my own balance and not believing it will only come through a marriage or dating relationship. I have pretty much avoided any thoughts of dating for years due to raising my kids. My youngest daughter is now a senior in high school and I think I am experiencing some empty nest syndrome.
I desire healthy, fun, loving relationships. But I seem to attract unhealthy and therefore have avoided until I could get to the bottom of why I attract those types.
Your words were encouraging to me and I appreciate them very much!
May you find blessings, joy, and peace in your journey too!
My name is Cathy.
Hi, John. You are correct that I am not rushing into looking for another man. But...
I have taken 10 years to consider it even a possibility. Somehow, I've always known that my moods could make it difficult to find the right kind of man to support and encourage during my needy times and be willing to accept my support and encouragement during theirs.
I continuously seek self improvement. I guess it is hard for me to believe there would be a man out there who is willing to work on themselves without trying to force me into being someone other than the real me.
I am learning. I am changing my thoughts too. Being able to chat with you and Kay so far has helped me not feel so alone.
Thank you,
Cathy
John, thanks for the tip about the book. I will check it out.
I agree that there will be times of fights in any relationship and the key is if we can resolve without being threatened. I guess the real thing for me has been that I have not met anyone interesting enough in a long time to take that chance.
I do have friends that I am able to disagree with and keep the relationship in tact. I believe my main issue is once there is romantic involvement. Both of my spouses professed their approval and love prior to marriage. However, once we were married, their interest in me changed. Honesty is a big deal to me. I can't seem to get past anyone lying to me. I can forgive many things, but I cannot trust someone without integrity.
We all have our quirks and none of us is perfect. I am willing to compromise, but not to be lied to or abused. I guess my belief is that anything can be worked through if you have honesty, respect, and kindness. Does that mean I have been perfect at offering these things at all times? No, but I am working on myself and willing to listen when approached in a humble way and not simply attacked.
Too many words seems to be a problem with me. I am working on that too. 
Open to your thoughts on my comments.
Hey Cathy,
It is so good to hear from you. I can SO relate to feeling depressed and low on self-esteem. It can be so hard to be depressed AND to have any sense of self-worth, at the same time. Your story sounds familiar to mind, in that you are kind of waiting for your kids to "leave the nest" before you get involved in a relationship with a man. I only have one 15-year old son at home, and I am going to really have a hard time when he goes to college. My life is so wrapped up in his activities, that it will be a true loss when he is no longer here.
Being depressed doesn't have to mean that you are not appealing to anyone. A couple of years ago, I was feeling pretty down and out, but I started having daily conversations with a co-worker that sat right next to me. It was all very mellow and didn't even hint at being anything more than a pleasant work relationship, at first. Slowly, ever so slowly, we got interested in each other, and we eventually even went out on a few dates. It had only been a short while since my husband had died, though, and I kind of backed out of the relationship. But I have to say, it was really nice to know that a guy found me attractive again. It did a world of good for my self-esteem, and this guy and I are still friendly today.
Would you mind sharing what happened at work, that they forced you into medical leave? I would be interested in knowing more about that. I once got fired from a job because of my depression and missing work, as a result of the depression. You can imagine what THAT did to my self-worth! I collected unemployment for six months and then found work at the place where I am currently employed - over five years later. Getting fired was a blessing in disguise, as I am very satisfied with the work I get to do every day.
So, hang in there while you are not working. Something could come along that will be even better than what you had before. Or, you may find that not working is actually good for you. I think we are all so individual on that front. I have fought being on disability most of my adult life. So far, I have managed to continue to work, and I think that is best for me. Work gives me a sense of purpose each day and makes me feel good to have been able to help other people out. It kind of gets me out of myself and focused onto other things. Whatever you are hoping for - to work or to not work - I will pray that it happens for you.
You mentioned too many words!! Boy, I can definitely relate to that. If anyone uses too many words it is me!! I just can't seem to help myself, though. It feels so good to express myself in writing. I get carried away with things, sometimes.
I absolutely agree with you that a person should not tolerate an abusive situation. No matter what a person has been through or what label they have been given, it is not an excuse to be violent to anyone else. Sadly, it seems that there are a lot of spouses of people with bipolar, who tolerate that kind of abuse on a daily and yearly basis, attributing it to the "disease" of bipolar. I never could understand why some women would continue to stay in an abusive relatinship, day in and day out. I expect to be treated better than that, and I cannot tolerate it if I am not being respected enough for the person to refrain from physical and/or emotional abuse. The experience I DID have with it was enough for me to get out right away.
I hope you will stay in touch. It really sounds like you are doing well, in spite of being depressed. The fact that you have opened up and feel okay about sharing on this forum is a really good sign. So often we isolate ourselves from the entire world when we are depressed.
Keep those posts coming! My thoughts and prayers are with you,
Kay
Hey Kay. Thank you for your posts. It seems to be giving me hope just being able to connect with people who understand.
As for my job situation, I worked for a locally owned bank. However, the locally owned means owned by the Walton family. You know, Walmart Walton family.
I have a degree in organizational management which taught us that the greatest asset to any employer is an empowered employee. My entire education was based upon getting rid of micromanagement and finding the best fit for myself and others within an organization.
My employer is stuck in micromanagement big time and if you speak truth or stand up for your rights, they find a way to dispose of you.
I had disclosed my bipolar to my employer to help me accomodate my environmental triggers. The boss who hired me, was fired and new management took over. Their philosophy was to push and push and push some more. They pitted coworkers against each other and marketed customer service at a high cost while forcing us to be unable to deliver that quality customer service due to constant changes and pulling us in too many directions.
They called meetings under the guise of "how can we help you?" and then used anything I said against me. Whatever I said I needed, they did the opposite.
Anyway, there is way more to the saga than I care to post. My dilemma is that I now KNOW that I am not good at nor like the jobs I've always had to do. I also have major back issues making it difficult to sit at a computer all day long with a phone on my shoulder and work faster than my brain will allow.
I would prefer not to be on this road as I believe I am still a valuable employee if I could find the right type of job. I am a hard worker and desire to be an asset in anything I do.
I am currently clerking for flu clinics to earn some cash until something more lucrative comes along. Disability was not my choice, but it seems that now I allowed them to force me down this road, nobody is interested in giving me a chance.
I need to be doing something to help others too. I am a people person, not numbers person. I am a good listener and genuinely care about the person talking to me.
Thank you for your prayers and encouragement. I've been a prayer minister and was recently asked to step down due to the pastor's wife having issues with me. The people I was ministering to are struggling, but God is the ultimate healer. I miss that outlet, but believe God will bring something along in His timing.
Today was a better day. I am still dealing with depression, but force myself to exercise, and do some physical work daily to expend my energy. I just wish I could sleep better.
Blessings to you and thanks again for your posts!
Cathy
Cathy, You are good at recognizing qualities and areas to address.. With chronic physical illness onto of mood or mental illness - you don't have an easy road.
Since you said you like helping people have you thought about a part time paid position maybe from your local health department or mental health warm line. Sorta like talk therapy to someone other than a regular hours professional. Our community has one from home few hours a night - paid to listen and make some referals if needed.
It might be something part time to help and still give you some comfort from home. also medical transcriptions is another good home opening for bipolar since you can work at your own pace to a degree, take breaks, type on the couch or laying in the bed if needed. Good luck and you are a smart girl and didn't let the stigma and ignorance of management take the wind from your sails..
So I wish you all the best.
Magnolia
Hi John. Sounds like to me that you both have an awesome chance since you are both aware of your trust issues.
I'd love to hear how it goes, as I am learning vicariously through others until I meet someone I am willing to take a chance on.
Wishing you both much joy as you learn to trust each other!
Thanks for sharing!
Cathy
I have been married to my husband for 11 years and I really don't understand what "emotional saftey" is! We love each other, we fight with each other, we have our quirks of character, I have biplolar and he does not. I trust him, and he trusts me. I take my meds for my problems, and he deals with his problems. When we can help each other we do, when we have to go it alone we do. We have a child who is healthy and smart and understands bipolar and understands also that people can just have a bad day. I was misdiagnosed for 9 years,a nd we got thorugh that - even though we didn't know what the hell was going on.
So, I don't look for emotional safety. Physical safety, certainly, but anyone can be emotionally unstable at any time, even dogs and cats (well mine anyway!). I think we need to learn to live with emotional instability and deal with it appropriately, not be frightened of it.
Many of my friends are emotionally unstable some times, it does not mean that it has any impact on my "safety". They have to deal with their problems and I have to deal with mine.
Living with someone who is bipolar is not something I have dealt with (apart from living with myself!), but my husband has lots of problems stemming from an extremely abusive childhood. Marriage is about acceptance and trust as well as love. It's not easy, it's hard work even for "normal" people.
My husband enjoys my hypomanic phases (which, apart from mania is my usual state of mind) he does not have to do any housework fro a start! But, he makes me decaf coffee, suggests I might need a little more medication (gently) and I appreciate his concern (sometimes I don't and go nuts at him!). When I go nuts he knows it's the illness talking, not me. He deals with my emotions, he does not look for safety.
I am safe physically, but cannot imagine a life full of emotional safety, whatever that is. I don't think anyone has one - well no-one I know. And it makes life interesting sometimes. I don't want to be a laid back, peaceful, relaxed person all the time, and I don't think many people can do that.
I think it's just as important to recognise emotional instability and deal with it - "emotional safety" is not a phrase, or a lifestyle, that I could live with, and I don't really think such a life exists.
What happens when your child is bullied at school and needs to learn how to deal with it? Do you tell them they need to go for the safe option - stay away (unless it's physical violence), or do you teach them how to deal with the other person's "emotional instability"? It would be false to assume that "emotional safety" exists. I use the method of helping my child understand the other person and to deal with that person appropriately, not the "run away" strategy (that means the bully wins). And when your child has bad days emotionally, do you remove yourself from that situation cause it's "not safe" or do you help them through it, and not freak out yourself?? Personally I don't find it "emotionally unsafe" to deal with my child's ups and downs - and though sometimes I would dearly love to wrap her up in cotton wool and protect her - I can't - that would be unfair and "unsafe". SHe neds to learn to deal with different people, or she'll end up a basket case.
My mMum's an alcoholic, she has plenty of issues, but I can deal with her, I don't step away all the time (unless it's necessary for my own health). I can deal with her cause I know she has an illness, just like me, and that she needs support too.
Hope this makes sense. I am not saying that being physically unsafe should be tolerated in any situation - bipolar or not. I am just saying that I don't think there is any way out of dealing with other's (and your own) emotions for anyone. You have to accept the emotion, deal with it, and not run away from it. Emotions are an every day of life - to me "emotional safety" would mean shutting myself away from other people permanently.
If the situation or friendship becomes toxic, you have the choice to remove yourself, fair enough - i've had friends like that (mentally ill or not). But my husband and I have had some toxic times, and we got through them - we worked damned hard, but we made it through.
I am not trying to undermine what anyone else has said here - i'm probably just being semantic - but I am a firm believer in getting the terms right.
Narelle
I think alot of people can understand bipolar, they do not have to have it themselves. Sure there is stigma - but let's not underestimate the good people out there. I think you can find a good relationship without having to have one with someone who has the same illness as yourself. That's like being diabetic and thinking you have to marry a diabetic, so you can understand and support each other. And I can't imagine my parent's marriage having lasted 45 years if they were both alcoholics - it would have been pretty difficult to say the least - I mean who on earth would be the designated driver (joke - but hey!)
Narelle
Narelle,
I think by "emotional safety" they meant something different than your assumed definition. I take what they are saying is that "emotional safety" is the feeling of understanding, trust, and acceptance of themselves that they are looking for in a partner. Sounds like you have that with your spouse!! That is great. Semantics here, IMO
I have never read anything so real. It shouldn't be so hard to have a relationship. Bipolars have enough to deal with without someone being condescending all of the time. My favorite is, "Do you need to go back to the hospital? or "Do I need to call your parents?" I am 44 y/o. No. But, I do need my partner to stop cussing me and calling me a nut-case. That would be enough to make anyone mad. Like you, bipolar redirected my life AND I'm ok with it. So much made sense once the diagnosis and meds came along.
That was 10 years ago. Now, my therapist says that I haven't accepted being bipolar because I still let things bother me that others don't think should. Like you, I just want as normal relationship as possible without all of the hassle. FYI: I'm pretty certain that my husband is bipolar BUT no diagnosis/meds. just lots of fits, spending sprees, cigarettes, alcohol, irrational thinking. As I say, "And I'm the one taking medication?" You have to protect yourself first and roll with the insanity of the world...the people who don't seek help are worse off that those who do.
But, why does a label mean you have to be on a microscope slide for the rest of your life? Even Jesus forgave the thieves that hung beside Him and the soldiers who hung him. Why can't just a little of that compassion swing our way?
Keep praying and keep trying. The long-distance thing might be the way to go. This is my 2nd marriage....I could tell you tales BUT my parents could tell you more because I've blocked so much of it out.
Why? Why would an advanced degreed woman subject herself to that? Simple, I don't want to be lonely. The ghostly silence makes the unbelieveable "stuff" of the past simply unbearable. You may have hooked into the "right" way. Bipolar, 3 simple syllables that, for some reason give some people the idea that they have power over us. We must keep fighting for our rights....to have a decent life and a happy emotional relationship.
Keep working. Your vocal power needs to stay strong and real about the ordeals and the benefits of being bipolar. All of us making noise will get absolutely no where. One chief, many indians.
There's so much out there that people don't tell you. Like, my first husband, teacher, preacher had my children (8 and 12) help him burn all I owned....and then, Heh!, I was crazy, what did I know. Yes, there were witnesses, but we live in good ole boy MS where mental illness is surmount to being satonic. Oh, he got custody--I was too depressed. That's just a sprinkle. Now, #2 likes to drink and go into his "nutcase" rage...but, that doesn't happen either, after all I have the problem. The neighbors who hear it outside and come to me about it (R u ok?). Most days he's all right. (wow)
Needless to say, I've lost my jobs. So now the focus is on securing enough education so that I don't have to worry so much about the label.
Take care and thanks for responding. I wish you so much luck!! Get the word out that all of us Bipolar people are not totally crazy....no more than the rest of the world is.
Keep praying and keep trying. The long-distance thing might be the way to go. This is my 2nd marriage....I could tell you tales BUT my parents could tell you more because I've blocked so much of it out.
Why? Why would an advanced degreed woman subject herself to that? Simple, I don't want to be lonely. The ghostly silence makes the unbelieveable "stuff" of the past simply unbearable. You may have hooked into the "right" way. Bipolar, 3 simple syllables that, for some reason give some people the idea that they have power over us. We must keep fighting for our rights....to have a decent life and a happy emotional relationship.
Keep working. Your vocal power needs to stay strong and real about the ordeals and the benefits of being bipolar. All of us making noise will get absolutely no where. One chief, many indians.
There's so much out there that people don't tell you. Like, my first husband, teacher, preacher had my children (8 and 12) help him burn all I owned....and then, Heh!, I was crazy, what did I know. Yes, there were witnesses, but we live in good ole boy MS where mental illness is surmount to being satonic. Oh, he got custody--I was too depressed. That's just a sprinkle. Now, #2 likes to drink and go into his "nutcase" rage...but, that doesn't happen either, after all I have the problem. The neighbors who hear it outside and come to me about it (R u ok?). Most days he's all right. (wow)
Needless to say, I've lost my jobs. So now the focus is on securing enough education so that I don't have to worry so much about the label.
Take care and thanks for responding. I wish you so much luck!! Get the word out that all of us Bipolar people are not totally crazy....no more than the rest of the world is.
I don't know if the first send went through so I'll send again. If it did, pardon the mistake. Sometimes it's hard to tell.
from someone writing who has bipolar disorder themselves, i am annoyed at how judgemental you are being. yes, abuse is wrrong and it isn't right. but every person is different and reacts to medications differently. every case is different, and as you know the illness ranges in severity. thank god you dont have such severe irritability, or the medications soothe your symptoms, you have never verbally or physically abused someone. the abuser and loved ones both suffer. but you shouldnt assume, the bipolar person is abusing out of having/wanting a free pass because of their diagnosis. thats obnoxious.
Hi, Anonymous. I hope you're not suggesting that because someone with bipolar is having a rough time that the partner should tolerate abuse in the relationship. It doesn't matter whether or not the person with bipolar is technically responsible for his or her outrageous behavior. The bottom line is no one should be expected to have to put up with it. We are talking serious safety issues here.
Judgmental? Damn straight. When it comes to abusers, I want to see the right arm of God come down with full force. Bipolar? Too bad. Until we accept responsibility and stop looking for excuses, it will be the rest of the world who keeps judging and pre-judging us harshly.
We want a fair deal? First we have to take responsibility.
No, i am not suggesting someone should put up with abuse because of a persons diagnosis. Some do though, out of pure compassion and love. The only point I am trying to make is someone who has abused can suffer as much as the victim, in different ways. Extreme guilt, regret, and hate for themselves because they behaved in a manner that is very shameful to them, as they never intented to hurt their loved one or ones. They are a victim to their symptoms. Accepting responsibility would be for the bipolar to comply with the proper medications and therapy, to try and prevent the same future situation.
thanks for the reply.
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