Frederick Goodwin: What the NY Times Left Out

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Hi John,

 

It’s been some time since I’ve last corresponded with you and some 13 or more years since you began your journalistic endeavors on this side of the pond as we then first met through the Internet.

 

I wanted to share my thoughts on this and several other subjects as well as saying hello to Moira, another long-time familiar mental health advocate.

 

I am disturbed and troubled by the changes I perceive in the news media and those who claim to be journalists/reporters or practice journalism.  I find that the media is geared more so than ever for sensationalistic headline grabbing and eye catching reporting as opposed to any in depth objective and impartial gathering of facts and information for presentation.  To the contrary it seems the news media is a culprit similar to what many are accusing the pharmaceutical companies of doing in selling their products as both industries are out to be profit making organizations.

 

I was recently booted from participating on Furious Seasons, Philip Dawdy’s blog (see The Rest of The Story)  http://vnsdepression.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=639 as I disagreed with his thoughts.  I cited the definition of journalist and journalism to him as he persistently cites his professional endeavors in an attempt to regain employment and in my opinion his thoughts and writings are often more like prosecutor, jury, judge and executioner which in turn brought me to his recent blog relating to Dr. Goodwin in which I noticed comments relating to you.  I also spotted Moira’s reply and since I’m excommunicated from his site I thought I’d share some of my thoughts here and at the same time give a shout to Moira.  That is unless you also have a need to ship me off to Siberia.

 

As a very long-time support person and caregiver to my spouse my main concern has always been to achieve her wellness through any means.  Knowing that which I do after more than 45 years in my role as researcher I’ve learned that these most serious mood disorders are truly a bitch to treat and that treatments need to be made available while newer treatments are also researched simply because many of the conventional therapies are either refractory or simply don’t work for this unique population of patients.  Most importantly is that I continue to advocate for the reasonable education of the patient and his/her support person(s) in collaboration with one’s trusted, knowledgeable and licensed health care practitioner to make un-coerced medical decisions while at the same time encouraging hope and persistence.

 

In away I find Senator Grassley’s investigations refreshing in terms of uncovering and/or exposing seeming improprieties and/or apparent or intentional oversights on the part of a number of these leading professionals but I have yet to read of any indictment, trial or criminal verdict against any of these individuals.  Are we some how also regressing to the McCarthy era?  Industry funding of research studies and researchers have been in evidence for decades.  Without the funding we’d probably have little research in my opinion.  What concerns me more; did these individuals intentionally and/or knowingly signs off upon documents or promoted research that was truly compromised or corrupted etc, etc.  From my standpoint I’ve read many conflicting interpretations of the same data as viewed by numerous professionals.  So just what is the truth?

 

I appreciate Moira’s response about her doctor (Goodwin).  I’ve long felt that if a witch doctor could’ve helped my spouse that would have been good with me too.  What is important is that apparently Goodwin has assisted her and she believes in the man and that in and of itself is a large part of these battles.

 

So Grassley’s uncovered these improprieties and apparently no criminal charges are being filed (to my knowledge at the moment) while patients have praised these same doctors for helping them; maybe what has to come of all this is a changing of the rules and responsibilities.  Self-regulation and policing of doctor’s cannot be left any longer to their unions (AMA, APA etc) and transparency and disclosure should become law with penalties for failure to do so for both the payer and recipient.  At least we then have a better understanding of the money trail but that doesn’t mean a professional’s morals, integrity or honesty is corrupted even when there is transparency.

 

And maybe journalists like Philip Dawdy could be more objective in their fact gathering and subsequent reporting.

 

My best wishes to you and yours and all those who participate here while I also wish for y’all peace, prosperity and a Happy Thanksgiving.

 

Warmly,

Herb

VNSdepression.com

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hey, Herb. Great to hear from you again. Phil Dawdy banned you from his site? Phil Dawdy, libertarian, upholder of free speech? A quote from a Dawdy blog:

 

"So you know, there are some mental health blogs, websites and forums where it's easy to get banned for disagreeing with the admin or by fighting too hard over certain issues (SSRIs, for example), or for not having the right politics. Or, sometimes, the admin or writer will just come attack you in comments a la John McManamy. I don't do that and generally only get pissy with commenters when someone challenges my right to say X or Y about Issue A or B.

 

"It's a free country and a free market of ideas. I'll say what I want. So should you."

 

So I guess Dawdy doesn't believe in himself anymore. :)

 

Don't worry, Herb. You're more than welcome, here.

 

Also, Herb, I whole-heartedly agree with your comments posted here and on your website.

 

To readers:

 

We encourage posting here and free expression of ideas. But occasionally people do get banned for abusive comments, spamming, and in one case a cyber-stalker. We encourage the free expression of ideas and spirited conversation, but in a setting that is safe for everyone. The simple rule - if what you say here would get you kicked out of a face-to-face meeting, it will probably get you kicked out of here, too.

 

As to the comments posted by "Truth." For obvious reasons, I'm not going to reply. But I will respond to one point he raised:

 

Three years ago, when HealthCentral recruited me here to write for BipolarConnect, I expected I would last six months at best. Since they pay me as an "expert patient" contributor, I expected that they would tell me what I could and couldn't write and how I should be writing it. Moreover, the site carries drug company ads, and I have written pieces critical of the drug industry and of psychiatry. Instead, I was pleasantly surprised to find that HealthCentral gave me carte blanche to write as I pleased, and encouraged me to take on new writing challenges.

 

I did have misgivings at first that the presence of drug company ads would affect my credibility as a journalist. But it turns out the presence of ads only matters to a fringe group of antipsychiatrists who are beholden to something far worse - a rigid ideology.

 

My guess is that if HealthCentral tried to tell me what to write, they would have gone out of business before I would have had a chance to quit. A lot of health websites started on the premise that they could attract advertising by posting crappy content, with the hope that readers would be fooled by stupid gimmicks. A lot of those websites no longer exist, and others have been sold to buyers at fire sale prices.

 

I signed on with HealthCentral when they were little more than a small start-up. Now, they're one of the largest and most respected health sites on the web. Anything can happen when the bottom falls out of the economy, but I'm looking forward to many more years of practising here as an independent journalist.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

wait, herb of many faces and genders fame and mcmanamy of many pharma ads are going after dawdy? that's funny. compared to you guys, he's the pillar of integrity. my hunch is he banned herb over personal attacks but who knows?

 

happy thanksgiving to you both.

This is a absolute perfect match made in Hell! So nice to see Herb and Johnny Boy hugging and kissing over Philip Dawdy being superior to them as a true genuine person, active humanitarian, certainly as a mental health advocate, a real professional journalist, and a brilliant writer to boot! Tis, Tis, Jealousy is going to get you nowhere in this world small minded little boys without toys.

 

You both should be over there on your knees kissing some serious behind right now! Because your betting on the wrong and lame horse in this race; and your both about to be put out to pasture for good. So keep it up your children playing among men act (it is trite and amusing in a sick sort of way). You will definitely reap what you sow tenfold at the very least in this kids game your playing. Invite your racist and corrupt friend Dr.Goodwin to the party also; before he's in a jail cell with one of those urban blight home boys he so wanted to medicate. I bet he makes a lot of cool aid then!

 

Truth

 

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Well Jones or whatever identity you’re using at the moment, good for you; I’m glad you have some reading skills but seemingly lack the ability to research or are simply too lazy to seek the answers to your questions. 

 

“He's the pillar of integrity. my hunch is he banned herb over personal attacks but who knows?” --- Jones

 

I would hope all your life’s decisions aren’t based upon your hunches.  The answer to this hunch was stated in my comment.  Maybe you missed it?  Try the same link to The Rest of The Story.

 

While you’re at it you might ask Stephany does she too have hunches?  I know she finds it interesting my knowing John but after many years I’ve come to know many mental health advocates and health care professionals.  Does the fact that John and I know each other from the Internet probably longer than you, Philip or Stephany have come on scene constitute we’re guilty of something by association?  Maybe the fact is all your hunches, presumptions and hearsay ain’t worth a hill of beans, at least in my opinion.

 

As for Philip Dawdy I think he attempts to do a noble and worthwhile service along with many others including John McManamy who peak my interest but that doesn’t mean I have to agree with Philip’s thoughts or anyone else or those that bow to Philip’s every word.  Unlike you and many of the hardliners it is not necessary for me to take an either or position.  I take what I believe to be worthwhile and helpful for my purposes as a support person and I leave the rest behind while not intentionally attacking anyone.  But then again it appears that disagreeing with ones viewpoints or thoughts for some constitutes a personal attack upon ones person.

 

Oh by the way, I’m glad to see you’re following me about and sharing your intellect; you might even learn something along the way if you really try to read carefully.

 

As for your buddy Truth and his adolescent remarks of 9:01 PM, well, I’m still chuckling.

 

Warmly,

Herb

VNSdepression.com

 

 

 

 

Does health central pay you to attack others such as mental health news blogger Philip Dawdy? How you write here reflects your employer, or maybe it's the other way around.

I'm not sure whether you were addressing this to Herb or me.

 

Herb is not employed by HealthCentral and neither am I.

 

Herb is a visitor to this site, and is free to post what he likes, within the usual bounds of good behavior.

 

I have a contract with HealthCentral that includes being reimbursed for articles here, this blog, and other services. HealthCentral doesn't tell me what to write.

 

As for "attacking" others: Would you be making these comments if we had all "attacked" Dr Goodwin?

So you are being paid for your writings here. That's what I thought. If Philip Dawdy had not banned Herb would you have attacked Dawdy? If Goodwin had not been caught up in a Senate investigation would we be talking at all?

 

No.

Yes, this was addressed to John in my quiry over payment/reimbursement. What other services does HealthCentral pay for? Just out of curiosity? travel expenses for speaking engagements? etc?

 

Hi, Anonymous. Your "curiosity" is not a valid reason to be asking this question.

 

I am paid for my contributions here as an "expert patient." This means anything you see on this site with my byline. HealthCentral does not underwrite any of my other activities. Most of those - such as attending mental health conferences and promoting my book and producing my own videos - come out of my own pocket.

 

On my own website, mcmanweb.com, you will see display ads. Most of these are via Google, the same type that used to appear on Furious Seasons before Google terminated their arrangement with Phil Dawdy. Some also appear via an ad service run by HealthCentral. A full disclosure statement can be found on my website.

 

 

Thanks for the clarification.

Bt the way, what does the topic of Google terminating their agreement with Dawdy have to do with this discussion?

Because a number of posters here - readers of Phil Dawdy - have attacked my credibility on the sole basis of the appearance of display ads. Phil Dawdy on his blog with dreary regularity always brings this up as well. But the fact is that Phil Dawdy also carried ads on his site until Google ended the arrangement. So, really, it's time to end this nonsense about ads. Readers are free to judge us on our content, and make up their own minds.

 

Anyway, the question is legit. Thanks for asking.

DTC ads are dangerous.

Herb wrote: ".... was recently booted from participating on Furious Seasons, Philip Dawdy’s blog (see The Rest of The Story)  http://vnsdepression.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=639 as I disagreed with his thoughts.  I cited the definition of journalist and journalism to him as he persistently cites his professional endeavors in an attempt to regain employment and in my opinion his thoughts and writings are often more like prosecutor, jury, judge and executioner."

 

Amen!  My thoughts exactly.

 

Gina Pera, journalist-advocate

http://www.ADHDRollerCoaster.com

Many thanks, Moira. Sounds like you pal around with terrorists with those kind of associations. :) I promise I won't rat you out to the NY Times. But if I find out you once attended elementary school when you were a kid - sorry, I can't protect you.

Many thanks, Judy. Check out the link to my article in my blog above, "Why Newspapers Have Lost Their Credibility." In a nutshell, even when they were raking in record profits, newspapers have been cutting costs for more than two decades, including laying off senior journalists and editors. Now, with revenues drying up, newsrooms are working with virtual skeleton staffs. 

 

Journalists no longer have time to put into investigative pieces, check out their sources, etc. They are under extreme pressure to file fast and file often. Inexperienced journalists file stories that are not properly vetted. Also, these days, with less editorial oversight, it's easier for journalists to go rogue. This is especially true in specialty beats, such as health and science. Who, in the NY Times chain of command, has the smarts to distinguish a good piece of investigative health journalism from an antipsychiatry hatchet job?

 

Obviously no one.

 

As Moira said. Times are hard. Journalists are sloppy.

Journalists are also overworked and under the gun, working for jerk publishers, and really tired of b.s.

 

We can thank the likes of Google and Craigslist for helping to siphon off newspapers' profit centers, but we can also thank greedy philistines like Sam Zell.

Hi, Sekhar. I agree that there are untold people out there, quick to condemn, without even checking the facts. But Dr Goodwin doesn't need an investigation to clear him. His dealings with GSK and others were public and above board. If anyone needs an investigation, it's the NY Times. I'd like to find out what their sorry excuse was for going to press with that piece of gratuitous character assassination.

Hi, Inthebeginning. Many thanks for your post. You have had a very positive experience with meds and psychiatry and people need to know that.

Up until I was dx'd BP1 in 2000 by my assigned physc in rehab, I self medicated with

street drugs and alcohol.  Does that mean I sue my drug dealers? 

 

It is my understanding that this illness is complicated and unfortunately for us it may take time for doctors to realize what cocktail works well for us.  Ever reminding us why

the suicide rate is so high for bp ~ er's.   I self medicated for 30 years.  I'm lucky to be

alive, and I know that.  I destroyed relationships and lives, including my own.  But I am

not going to hash out in my head the blame game.  I've had over 10 doctor's play which cocktail works and countless drug dealers basically doing the same thing without

knowing it.  My daughter suffers from this illness and is just know beginning to deal with the day to day suffering and confusion and frustration that this brings forth.

 

For me it is difficult to not have a quick fix to this illness, such as heart disease, etc. but it is what it is and I have to educate and empower myself to keep the focus on surviving, less I finally decide to give up and let go.  I refuse to become that hopeless, I have children pushing me, sometimes quickly sometimes slowly.  But every single day I wish I didn't " feel " so crummy and every single day I thank God and my doctor for at least finding the right cocktail that I am clean and sober today from alcohol and drugs.

Be Thankful for the progress you have made, bp - er's and keep pressing forward if you haven't gotten there yet.  The numbness drugs afforded me was exquisite pain and only suicide could out do that.  But being of clear mind today I won't allow that to happen.  I choose instead to empower myself and press on.  The politics of drug companies and the messengers associated with there growth is there business, for me finding a good doctor is all I care about - as he will get paid to decifer which and what program works in my life.

Sorry to hear about your life long struggle, but now you have that nice label; you can turn in those nasty illegal street drugs, and be legitimately addicted to the ones your doctor gives you! 30 years on streets drugs and alcohol is a long time; what evidence do you have it wasn't the drugs that made you ill, and not the label you got plastered on you. Now as far as heart disease goes, there are no quick fixes; just because someone has a bypass, takes medication, or changes their life style, they still have heart disease. But kudos for those new drugs you have kicked the habit with, kudos to the doctor that is paid by you, and then again by the pharmaceutical industry! Sounds to me like you’re a victim in so many ways it's impossible to count. But kudos for your recovery and wellness. Sad, Sad story, but I just don’t see the happy ending here though. How many more cocktails will you go through until you find out it didn’t work? Then you may find yourself in a real pickle! Thank Goodness there is always AA meetings to rely upon. Good luck and grace be with you in your journey. PS just a hint of reality; they are using Seroquel and other prescribed psychotropic drugs on the streets now, just crush and snort! Funny how these things go round and round? Truth

There is no words to describe what a response like yours brings up in me.

 

It may appear I'm addicted to my new drugs, but without them I cannot live.

 

The street drugs were purely recreational, dangerous and at the end of the night the

anxiety and depression prevailed.  At the time I didn't know that, I just knew they offered a temporary reprise from the anxiety and grief.

 

The new drugs do not alter my mind and are not addictive, if you choose to do your

research on depakote or seroquel you may learn something.  I'm aware of the street use of seroquel, but my prescribed dosage of 25 mg

at night to sleep sure beats a handful of quaaludes or benzo's and alcohol, but you seem rather lacking in your information about those hazards.

Have a nice day.

Hi, Floridagirl. Be assured:

 

I sincerely apopolgize for the highly inappropriate personal attack that a totally thoughtless poster subjected you to.

 

I brought the matter to the attention of BipolarConnect. Because of the holiday weekend, the response to this poster may not be immediate, but I assure you it will be appropriate.

Now, now, now! Johnny Boy:

 

PERSONAL ATTACK??? I offered other reasoning and possible solutions to some obvious problems and concerns! Are you debating that anti psychotics don't have addictive qualities and severe withdrawal symptoms on this site?

 

Now attacking Philip Dawdy the way you did is personal and should be considered by the administration of this site as out of line and out of policy boundaries!

 

I have offered you an honest critique of your article as you are a paid spokesperson and do represent this site. Some honest and non evasive answers would have been adequate. But you can't do that, now can you? I caution not to make threats toward me, I can also take action you may find objectionable.

 

You have been officially reported for your abusive commentary and threats!

 

Truth

P.S. TRUTH

I am on a PAP with both pharmaceutical companies and haven't paid for my meds

in over 2 years.

Also, BP is part of my family history.

Were is your objectives and reasoning theories now?  And were are your suggestions??

They scream personal attack - why don't you re read your post.  You became

obsessed and swayed away from objective suggestions.

 

The illegal drugs did not make me ill , I already was ill. 

I haven't paid for doctors or drugs in several years.

Be careful what you say, people are paying attention.

hi, William. I appreciate your concerns. If by an investigation, you mean an impartial government panel to investigate the propriety of current industry/professional practices and associations with a view to reforming the law and setting new standards, I'm all for you.

 

If by investigation, you mean some prosecutorial authority singling out one individual or a small group of individuals I couldin't be more opposed. This smacks of McCarthyism, and constitutes extreme violations into a person's life. Peronsal iinvestigations never "clear" individuals. Investigators are always looking for dirt, and won't stop until they find something that they can spin into dirt. We have a bad history in this country of runaway special prosecutors and congressional panels.

 

But again, I very much share your concerns about conflict of interest. We badly need reform.

I posted once on Furious Seasons & boy was I attacked for taking psych meds for bipolar 1.  Then when I further explained about my mother having bipolar & committing suicide & my own suicide attempts & the meds helping--somehow the people thought the meds CAUSED these thoughts & behaviors.  I had to explain I went to the pdoc AFTER the suicide attempts, not before.  Most people don't seek psychiatric help when they are doing great.

 

Anyway, it ended on a note that I was pathetic in that I had been conned into thinking I needed these meds "to be better" , but at least they weren't attacking me anymore.  I left feeling like they had some kind of compassion rather than animosity.

 

But, John, one posting I gave here a rather long time ago you reacted rather strongly in a negative way--sort of "so this & this & this is going wrong!! I think you need a new provider, new meds & look at yourself more closely (almost--as I intepreted it blaming me for my relapse as I did have an OD after 5 yrs. of stability as a bp 1 person).  I was in a vulnerable state & I guess felt close to you (foolishly, I know, but I've been reading & supporting you for years; you don't know me from Adam) & it hurt to be dismissed it that way as "pull up those bootstraps or whatever."

 

I don't know how this relates to this whole exchange--just that sometimes strong things are written...-Suzanne

Hey - everyone is DIFFERENT.  From my personal experience there is no right way or

wrong way to reach the maximum benefit from my medication.  It took alot of years

and alot of doctors to finally reach what is working BEST for me now.  It is not the

solution but at this time is working BEST for me.

when You have lived my life then you can criticize me, TRUTH, until then STFU.

You really are making yourself out like an ass, if you know anything about this illness

the symptoms and responses to the drugs are all personal and need to be tailored individually as the brain is too complex right now for the patient or the doctor to know for sure what exactly works, why and when, etc.

 

I am fully aware of the dangers of seroquel and take the minimum dose.  I agree that some doctors and patients over prescribe.  But all I can do right now is worry about me, which is what I intend to do.  You on the other hand, TRUTH, seem to have your nose in other people's business and enjoy reacting and attacking -  and again I say you are turning out to look like quite an ass.

My advise to you is move on - give it up while you can.

 

Hi, Suzanne.

 

I ask you to reread the correspondence and get back to me. In the "Ask" feature in particular, people tend to articulate their concerns very eloquently, but the question they ask sometimes strays from these concerns. For instance, a person might ask a meds question, but in their lead-up they mention that they are stressed out and not getting any sleep. So I will tend to reply that the person needs to tackle the stress-sleep issues. (It's amazing how well meds suddenly work after stress and sleep are resolved.)

 

Now, of course, this may not be the answer you are expecting, but I submit it is the type of input that can help. I may miss the mark, which is why it is useful for other readers to offer their own wisdom.

 

So please re-read the correspondence. If my answer isn't along the lines I suggested, then please get back to me, and I will seek to resolve the issue to your satisfaction, including eating my own words, if I have to.

 

 

Hey, no need.  It was a long time ago.  You've got better things to do.  I'm just too sensitive.  I'm "still here."  Take care.--Suzanne

If that wasn't an attack post by Florida, then I guess there is no such thing here!

 

I simply questioned if after 30 years of self admitted drug abuse, was it possible that Bipolar 1 wasn't a diagnosis you might want to question; especially since within normal ranges Bipolar 1 usually manifest itself by late teens to early twenties. But you're right about not finding honest, supportive, and open discussion here!

 

 Johnny is running the show over here with his "expert patient" status; which he uses to actually diagnosis of his bipolar friends as in "bipolar plus". After reading those writings I would question how much you're so called friends would appreciate being labeled further by their friend? Last time I checked "expert patients" don't make those calls. I believe that is called misrepresentation of your qualifications and scope of duties you have here with this forum Johnny.

 

To Florida: So sorry you only see one horse to ride in this race to a functional life; but I do wish you well honestly in this journey! I do happen to believe in self determination and personal choice. Whether I agree or not is really inconsequential in your life and journey.

 

Truth

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Dear Truth,

 

I’m still chuckling at what I perceive as your adolescent ruminations.  Only a couple of your thoughts had any significance to me, one of which was:

 

“Whether I agree or not is really inconsequential in your life and journey.” --- Truth

 

Personally Truth I don’t believe if the truth did hit you with a 20 lb rock in the head you’d have the slightest inclination of fact.  You’re spewing of dogma and proselytizing like Stan and others as if y’all have the answers to my spouse’s challenges and that of others simply don’t cut the mustard for me.

 

For me descriptions of MDD (Major Depressive Disorder) or Manic Depression now referred to as Bipolar are more concise words each descriptive of laundry lists of symptoms.  These words describe the numerous symptoms I have observed for years and save me time either in writing or verbal discussion having the need to describe those numerous symptoms.  It is for people like you who hide behind anonymity to spew you garbage and that of labeling.  You want or like to be labeled; so be it.  My wife is not a label.  She’s real live human being challenged for many years by a list of symptoms which we more easily refer to as MDD (Major Depressive Disorder).  Thankfully her attending physicians treat her as a valued human being and do the best they can to control and stabilize her symptoms into long-term remission.

 

My spouse has suffered from a potentially fatal illness for which we thank our close and dearest friends for their understanding and support and those caring, knowledgeable and licensed health care physicians willing to listen to us and understanding our willingness to try and not give in or give up.  Included in those many, many treatments and therapies tried through the years was that of total abstention which in my opinion is also a viable option to be considered.

 

Add to which your obvious knowledge and understanding of addictions leave much in my mind to be desired.  Many medications have a “potential” for addiction but then again there is my spouse.  She has through the years repeatedly utilized many of the benzodiazepines and psychotropic drugs and has not become addicted or suffered any serious withdrawal symptoms contrary to your thoughts, Stan’s or many of the loyal party members on F.S.  But then again, you’re not interested in hearing facts as they contradict your party line.

 

I think it is remarks such as yours that exhibits in my mind your dogma, ignorance and obvious arrogance:

 

“So sorry you only see one horse to ride in this race to a functional life…” --- Truth

 

It matters first in my opinion that the patient be reasonably educated to make un-coerced and informed medical decision and then most importantly being able to achieve a reasonable degree of wellness and quality of life.

 

Floridagirl responded to you and most importantly shared of her reasonable wellness.  It is in my opinion your condescending, adolescent, proselytizing and dogmatic nature not to have simply wished her well and left it at that.  So I’ll take the liberty of saying “Good for you Floridagirl and so too you Suzanne.”

 

Whatever it takes Floridagirl and Suzanne to give you folks a reasonable quality of life I am for it while at the same time educating yourself to your treatment options so that in a rare instance I can agree with Truth in your “self determination and personal choice”.

 

Warmly,

Herb

VNSdepression.com

"If by investigation, you mean some prosecutorial authority singling out one individual ... have a bad history in this country of runaway special prosecutors and congressional panels."

 

Whatever gave you the idea I was suggesting anything of this nature?

I don't believe I quite understand what you are suggesting -- please explain what you mean by "addressing... community members" and how to develop conversation without addressing other members of this forum.

Hi, Gina. It's so refreshing to read your comments. There's way too much anti-science, anti-intellectualsim posing as mental health advocacy. Let's keep in touch -

Hi, Gina. It's so refreshing to read your comments. There's way too much anti-science, anti-intellectualsim posing as mental health advocacy. Let's keep in touch -