In my opinion, cause it is all that it is
From my personal knowledge of folks with Bipolar and other serious forms of MI AND having become a member of this website for several years AND a member of another Bipolar website - thus getting to know far more folks with Bipolar than in "real life" - my opinion is that the reason why so many get "stuck" in recovery is because they are "stuck" in their illness.
The more responsible and proactive ones (that I know and have come to know) are fully med compliant, go to the groups, go to the therapy sessions, do the structured routine, etc.. etc.. BUT are everyday obsessed and consumed with how their illness is - every literal day. Every emotion, every mood, every feeling is analyzed, documented, "treated", and suspicioned. They have become "super observant" to their illness and as such... are too afraid to do anything that may rock the boat so to speak.
If they are "stable" and have been for say... years. For you to then mention the potential of them returning to work, thus going off the SSDI, throws them into high defensive mode. They can't return to work, they say. It's too stressful and too pressured and "what if...?" I've had many, in real life and in web life, say "I'm not going to risk my ongoing stability by returning to the workforce and dealing with working."
As far as relationships go; most have had bad runs at relationships and are now single. A few, are even in assisted living centers (nursing homes) because family placed them there. Folks don't get em and folks run from em and they get hurt emotionally. So... they become fearful and highly anxious of social interaction and figure, "what's the point?" or "once they find out about the Bipolar...."
Again... just my opinion.
I think you have made a very good point Tabby, there is a fine line between understanding and dealing with something and becoming obssessed. It is too easy to use bipolar as an excuse for doing or not doing something, and we can become so good at it that we even fool ourselves...By the same token, I can understand the fear of try to stretch out and do something when this has led to bad experiences in the past. We need to be kinder to ourselves and give ourselves a little more time to get it right, I find that sometimes this means putting up with being slower than other workers for a while until I get up to speed. I'm not sure if it is best for the boss to know the bipolar diagnosis or not. On the one hand if they know-they will give you more time, but sometimes they will give you too much latitude. If they don't know they may see you as an inexplicably suboptimal worker who is slowly improving, but if the job isn't secure they may not keep you long enough. In my experience government jobs are best as they are more likely to keep to fair workplace laws.
also - to work do they really need to go off the "SSDI" - which stands for ?- I assume mood stabilisers? I have worked successfully at a job needing some concentration and fine motor skills and taken medication for many years - the drowsiness effect does wear off once the body gets used to the medication (unless really large doses are needed?)
SSDI - here in the States, cause I'm not sure where you are - is Social Security Disability Insurance and if you qualify as totally disabled for a minimum of 12 months or longer (or will end in death), you get supposedly a percentage of what you've paid into it paid out in monthly checks. However, many many folks who've never worked or paid into it... also receive the checks on a monthly basis if they qualify.
I guess I'm one of the lucky ones. Although I'd worked hard throughout my life, at the time I was finally ready to cry uncle, I wasn't eligible for SSDI. My work had been freelance and part-time teaching and studying and babysitting for many years, so there was no disability there for me. I had to go on working. I doubt I'd still be alive if I'd been eligible for SSDI at that time. I doubt I'd be alive if my family had taken me in as an unfortunate, ill, unemployable dependent. Funny how what seemed to be a terrible thing ended up being the best thing.
I'm not lucky with the meds. They've done nothing good for me, and lots bad, and despite many years of compliance, three psychiatrists have told me they can do nothing. But I've been lucky in that I've been forced to persevere and continue working, and luckier still that I consider my work interesting and valuable, so I force myself to do it even when I'm at my worst so I won't let others (and myself) down. Yes, I've worked through manics, and depressions so low that the noose was constantly tempting my mind. I've run into the bathroom to stifle sobs over nothing more than the dire imaginations in my head. For many years I've woken up three hours early to get over the daily worst-of-it. There have been short stints when I couldn't work at all. Times when I went to work with no sleep or no restful sleep. Yet working makes me better! Sometimes it has been incredibly hard, sometimes I've worked harder to be able to work than to actually do the work, sometimes I haven't done the very best, but I thank God I have work I find meaningful. And thank God it gives me a reason for being alive when my disorder starts asking why the hell I'm still sucking in precious oxygen.
That stuck thing. It's the old foregone conclusion, no? Everybody knows that a person with mental illness is basically a lost cause. Everybody knows that we're broken and weird, and not fit for real employment. And most of us who suffer from mental illness buy into those assumptions. I know people who've only had one major episode, decades ago, and are still on SSDI. Their problems aren't necessarily any more severe than many so-called normal people, many of whom are frustrated and unhappy and frightened. But we with that scary diagnosis have been taught that we're fragile and useless, and shouldn't be expected to work. If we aren't careful, we start believing that crap. Next thing, we stop believing in ourselves.
This is why I shy away from support groups--I refuse to put myself in the category of people who have given up on themselves, and most everyone I've met in support groups have pretty much given up.
Yes, work is scary. Being out there in the world can be terrifying. But being unemployed and isolated from everybody but the broken is far scarier to me. I guess that's all I'm saying.
That relationship thing? Intimacy, need, power struggles, negotiations, hurt, trust, eros? Come on. That's way beyond me! I've got a mental illness, for God's sake!
GOOD FOR YOU!! i AM SO PROUD OF YOU! My son is BP and he has struggled with working, but he keeps on. He just landed a fantastic job, and he loves it. He definitely feels better when he is working, mentally and physically. And he has never had good luck with meds either. I agree with you about believing in yourself. My son said "I just want to be normal" and I told him he needs to find a new normal. We have had many discussions on not letting bipolar define who he is. Not to use it as an excuse. And he doesn't. (most of the time! lol) keep marching on! You sound like a wonderful person!
Elizabeth, it is precisely people like you who are most needed in support groups, as a beacon of success. Too bad the negative vibe of defeatism afflicts the groups you have visited. I have been in more hopeful groups. But giving back to our fellow sufferers is another way to battle the disease--as you're not thinking of yourself but those less fortunate.
I guess I'm one of the lucky ones. Although I'd worked hard throughout my life, at the time I was finally ready to cry uncle, I wasn't eligible for SSDI. My work had been freelance and part-time teaching and studying and babysitting for many years, so there was no disability there for me. I had to go on working. I doubt I'd still be alive if I'd been eligible for SSDI at that time. I doubt I'd be alive if my family had taken me in as an unfortunate, ill, unemployable dependent. Funny how what seemed to be a terrible thing ended up being the best thing.
I'm not lucky with the meds. They've done nothing good for me, and lots bad, and despite many years of compliance, three psychiatrists have told me they can do nothing. But I've been lucky in that I've been forced to persevere and continue working, and luckier still that I consider my work interesting and valuable, so I force myself to do it even when I'm at my worst so I won't let others (and myself) down. Yes, I've worked through manics, and depressions so low that the noose was constantly tempting my mind. I've run into the bathroom to stifle sobs over nothing more than the dire imaginations in my head. For many years I've woken up three hours early to get over the daily worst-of-it. There have been short stints when I couldn't work at all. Times when I went to work with no sleep or no restful sleep. Yet working makes me better! Sometimes it has been incredibly hard, sometimes I've worked harder to be able to work than to actually do the work, sometimes I haven't done the very best, but I thank God I have work I find meaningful. And thank God it gives me a reason for being alive when my disorder starts asking why the hell I'm still sucking in precious oxygen.
That stuck thing. It's the old foregone conclusion, no? Everybody knows that a person with mental illness is basically a lost cause. Everybody knows that we're broken and weird, and not fit for real employment. And most of us who suffer from mental illness buy into those assumptions. I know people who've only had one major episode, decades ago, and are still on SSDI. Their problems aren't necessarily any more severe than many so-called normal people, many of whom are frustrated and unhappy and frightened. But we with that scary diagnosis have been taught that we're fragile and useless, and shouldn't be expected to work. If we aren't careful, we start believing that crap. Next thing, we stop believing in ourselves.
This is why I shy away from support groups--I refuse to put myself in the category of people who have given up on themselves, and most everyone I've met in support groups have pretty much given up.
Yes, work is scary. Being out there in the world can be terrifying. But being unemployed and isolated from everybody but the broken is far scarier to me. I guess that's all I'm saying.
That relationship thing? Intimacy, need, power struggles, negotiations, hurt, trust, eros? Come on. That's way beyond me! I've got a mental illness, for God's sake!
Great discussion, here. Just a few quick points:
1. Disability - About six or seven years ago, at a conference, I heard a human resources guy say something along the lines of, "Run like crazy from disability." His point was it's a trap. Those who get on it very rarely get off it. I know many people need disability, but the payments are not nearly enough to get one's life back on track. The only draw is free medical. This leads into ...
2. One of you mentioned fear. We are a highly fearful lot. It is much easier for us to stay where we are - even if our life sucks - to take a chance on improving our situation. Moving to a better place takes a lot of energy, and pulls us into a lot of pain. Robert Cloninger has done a lot of work on this. Seeking out new friends, daring to share your life with someone, throwing off disability and finding employment - it's like letting go of the edge of the swimming pool. It's very difficult. There are no easy answers.
3. Re support groups filled with people who have given up (I prefer to say stuck) - It was one of my vexing concerns leading a DBSA group. You could always spot the people who were going to make it. They were the ones who had up to recently been working and their intention was to get right back to work. They expressed their profound gratitude there was a group like ours, and they came back week after week to learn everything they can. They were great to get along with and were fantastic contributors to the group. Then, they would announce they were going back to work and you never saw them again. Obviously, they went back to their lives, and when you're healthy and functioning it is never a good idea to hang out with people worse off that you - with one exception: We needed these people to come back in a helping role, lead by example, step into facilitator roles, start advocating. But - the stuck people are the ones who tend to stick around. I'm a big fan of support groups, but watch out for groups dominated by those who are stuck. For those of you who have moved on to well, we need you back to lead and facilitate. You are in a position to help countless people, plus you will help yourself by helping others.
This is a wonderful study. I've self-managed my illness well over the last 4 years. I ALWAYS take the meds but more importantly, whenever I see myself getting upset or pressured I take the steps to manage the swing and stop it early. These include, walking (Buddhist/Benedictine) meditation, or simply removing myself from the scene of the upset.
I am stuck with BD. As of now it is not curable but t is manageable. Mindfullness of the limits of this disorder, much as one is mindfull of physical limits to exertion, goes a long way to manage this disorder.
I've resumed my pre-diagnosis life a good 85%. It does take longer to do things without the hypomanic episodes but the work I do is good and well-considered. I'll take that as a trade off to "zooming and booming" any day.
We all know that, when manic, we don't usually seek out help. It's depression that brings us to the professionals. Most of my life it was like that until, at the age of 44, I literally could not go on, could not move, could not motivate, could not overcome the inertia of the deepest depression of my life.
I spent the weekend in a homeless shelter during the dog days of August, sharing a room with two elderly women, one of whom suffered urinary incontinenance. Each time I woke up (rarely) in the bunk above her, I felt that the experience of the shelter was more demeaning than if I were simply to become a bag lady and stop eating. My children were 7 and 9 at the time. All they knew is that Mom and Dad had a fight, Mom went to work, but never came home again.
You see, I know the exact moment my brain "broke." When my husband refused to give me a ride to work (though I had no other means to get there) and he added, "Negotiation was for the [domestic violence] shelter, NOT for here!"
At that moment I knew that, despite my best efforts, my dream of a family was never going to be real, that nothing I could do would ever give my children the cocoon of love and security they deserved as young human beings. I didn't know how to live without that.
In retrospect, I lost every ounce of hope that was ever in me and I became a shell of a human being -- almost catatonic. The last voluntary act I made -- instead of becoming a bag lady, after all, was to go to the shelter office to ask the staff person, "What if I decided I need help?" She told me to find a ride to the hospital 25 minutes away. I gave another shelter resident my last $4 for gas, the staff person was cautious enough to give my meds to that other resident with instructions not to give them to me, only to hospital personnel.
I had worked ALL my life from the age of 15, paying into Social Security. At times I even had 2 full time professional jobs even after I had kids. Needless to say, I did not have a supportive, but a very constantly critizing husband who abused me both verbally and emotionally and only ocaisionally physically.
Between constant in and out patient hospitalization over the next five months and away from my family, I encountered the concept of "wellness walks" during a 15 minute break between groups. I certainly did not have the energy even to consider it and couldn't imagine how walking for 15 minutes could possibly make me feel anything but worse. (You see, my first several days of inpatient, I had to be fed without even getting out of bed, I would not have showered or changed my clothes without constant encouragement from the professionals, and they didn't even get angry with me for not knowing I was supposed to be going to groups all day! I didn't even know about them for a week!!)
Fast forward several more in and out patient routines. They finally convinced me not to go home again if I wanted to get better. I moved into a 3/4 substance abuse house, not knowing how I could possibly be an alcoholic since I hadn't even consumed a case of beer in the previous 12 years!!
But AA and a sponsor did for me what 25 years of previous psychiatry had not been able to give me -- personal responsibility for my thoughts as well as my actions. I had been a blamer before then. So it is not surprising that I continued to point my finger at my husband instead of looking at the three pointing back at me.
Ten months after I entered AA, I swallowed 59 benedryl in a fit of rage at my husband for not allowing me to see my children. I continued with psychiatry, was compliant with meds, got an apartment, and, at the age of 14, my oldest child moved in with me even though all I did was sleep. HE was the one who teased me out of a certain degree of stuckness by noticing an ad for a parttime job in my previous field. I didn't think I could do it, but he kept telling me I could.
I was real slow at first, my graphic designs were poor, but I kept at it and one day "broke through" to a decent piece of work I felt confident about. One thing led to another -- with my son in the background encouraging me. I went to Rehab Services and went back to school for teaching certification.
First class, I couldn't even take notes without constant shaking. It got a little easier each class and I earned an "A". I took more classes. But I quit when I got to student teaching. I couldn't set limits and let the kids run over me. I quit before I failed student teaching.
I continued with my parttime job, though, and got better and got a promotion (still parttime). Then the company moved and I went to a very unsatisfying job at a big box store. I tried Rehab Services again, this time for nursing education.
Within a ten week period of my third year, my mother died, my youngest was shot (not fatally) in a driveby shooting by people she knew (her lifestyle), and my downstairs neighbor -- 15 years younger than me -- died. I went manic for five months before getting anywhere close to the right meds, the Dean of Students informed me that I would never graduate, and I hit the depths again. Just as I was regaining hope in a brighter future, it fell from under me.
I turned my attention to understanding this bipolar thing and studying literature on it and asking all kinds of questions of the professionals and other patients until I learned the role stress plays, lack of sleep, lack of routine, lack of exercise, lack of good eating habits. I couldn't afford to keep my car on the road and I had to walk. My granddaughter was born. I still was not well, was not stable and, while I had always been fully med compliant while diaganosed as depressed, I became strangely non compliant for a week to 10 days at a time under my bipolar diagnosis!!!!
But my granddaughter was born. I wanted to be in her life so much that I fought more daily battles and began to win some. I didn't care any more that my daughter and her father didn't want me alone with my grandbaby because I was "crazy" (read "not to be trusted with an infant").
I kept at it, even when I didn't feel like it. I pushed myself. I pushed more and more until I would collapse for a couple of days. But I got stronger. I continued to study -- mostly on my own, but with questions to my pdoc and therapist -- about this thing called bipolar. I began to recognize that it was every bit as much a physiological disorder as it was a mental disorder. I worked harder at what I could on the physiological basis (lifestyle).
But my granddaughter was born and we developed a beautiful, loving relationship. It taught me that I could have been the mother I had always thought I could be were it not for this disorder. I began to hope again from deep inside, that even though I had not been able to be a good enough mother, I was going to be a fantastic grandmother!
One day 8 months ago, I experienced an inside out complete joy moment. And things have improved rapidly since then. I have moved from fear of failure as a human being -- through no fault of my own -- to being a successful human being after all -- one who just happens to have bipolar disorder which requires as much vigilance to manage on a daily basis as it takes for a diabetic or heart patient to manage theirs. I am finally no longer controlled by my disease because I learned how to manage it.
Then I heard a Rollings Stones song from my past, "Ruby Tuesday." One line of lyrics goes, "If you lose your dreams, you just might go mad." So you might say that I relinquished my old unfulfillable dreams only after I had formed a new one....
My apologies for the length of this post.
I am primarily general anxiety disorder, secondary BP. I have been manic, depressed, and high anxiety that put me in ER three times. I worked stressful jobs dealing with the public. My last boss didn't even feel anyone should stay home for a headache and I sufferred from debilitating migraines so I always felt quilty when I called in sick for that. I have always been hard on myself when I made a mistake at work or at home. We have always had financial problems no matter how hard we have tried. I used to lay awake all night worrying. That led to anxiety, depression, headaches, mistakes at work, etc. My husband was gone all the time working. We did not have a life, and I sure didn't know what fun was. We have not had a vacation in 10 years. Then he wasn't working, but I continued at my job which did not provide health benefits, which caused more stress. He had a few parttime jobs while searching for a fulltime job.
Finally I really started to lose it at work. I was also spending two hours a day driving back and forth to my job. I became so weak I could barely walk. I couldn't sit at my desk for any length of time. I constantly had to get up and move around, or go to the break room and just sit with my head in my hands, or put my head down and take a short nap. I became shaky. I was having manic episodes, then depressions, often several times a day, and sobbing uncontrollably. Up to this point my husband just said you are tired cause you are out of shape, or go to bed earlier. He just didn't get what was going on.
One weekend I could not get off the couch. All I could do was cry. I actually felt like I was dying. I needed help to get to my bed and I was in bed all weekend. I called in sick Monday, then for the whole week. My husband decided I needed to see my Pdoc. My favorite one had moved 3 hrs away but we made the drive. He started treatment for GAD but it did not work. By then I had taken a months leave from work. I went back to the Pdoc and he recommended a Psych in my vicinity. He felt GAD and BP and put me on a med to try. I had already been taking Klonapin for several years. The new med did not work, so he tried another. By now I knew I could not return to work and hated to leave them hangng so I called from bed and told my boss I would not be returning. That alone was a major relief knowing I would not return to that stressful job. I was in bed for months. I went through several meds and dosages before we found one that I could tolerate. I still have manic days, and I still have depressions. I cannot tolerate stress, or anxiety. I try to read everything I can, but I don't think about it constantly anymore. I have applied for SSDI. The thought of returning to work leaves me sobbing and shaking. One reason is I have experimented by telling people about it and they just do not get it. If I had a sudden problem at work, nobody would understand what was going on and I am afraid. I am afraid of mistakes, and being hard on myself and all this starting all over again. I have to take a nap every day.
I would like to be able to work. It is bad enough when I feel I have let my family down and am hard on myself. I hate being a burden, but they are very supportive. I could not do that to my office workers. On a couple of occasions, I have been in a panic because I have had company coming and a wedding to attend, or have had to leave town and traverse an airport by myself. I just had to take my time and sit down when I needed to.
I have finally after 18 monthe tried to start excercising, following a strict diet to lose the weight I have accumulated, taken up some of my hobbies, etc. But I will never be able to work again.
I am a third-generation bipolar M.D. who quit practicing in his early forties due to chronic pain, not my bipolar illness.
My first question is: "How can you recover from a chronic, incurable disease?"
Eggsackly. It can be managed, as noted above.
I also did a five-year stint in AA which helped. I went there more for depression than alcoholism. I still drink but never get drunk.
Luckily for me I began a second career as a writer. It doesn't pay the rent (I have a private disability policy that does) but it occupies my time in a positive way. I just had my second book published:
http://cechaffin.com/light.html
I'm proud of it and it has received many glowing reviews. But the joy of art is in the process, not the completion or recognition. The same applies to our lives: We have this day and its choices. "Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof."
In AA I formulated an approach to life: FYFTA = "Face Your Fears and Take Action."
This requires courage but it always works, whatever the problem, unless you're psychotic and need some outside help.
I don't monitor my mood like a diabetic. I somewhat take it for granted, adjusting my medicines as needed but always informing my doctor. Luckily Lamictal has been providential for me as after 17 years I could no longer tolerate lithium.
Too many people get "stuck" on the disease, until it becomes all-consuming. I knew a Bipolar II who would spread out an incredibly detailed graph chart at meetings, as if he were a day trader in moods. This may be helpful early in the disease but long-term it makes one narcissistically impotent, as if the genii in the bottle had to be constantly corked. Although being bipolar has been the most important struggle of my life, it is only part of my life. I am in recovery every day I open myself up to life's possibilities. Avoidance doesn't work. Inaction is also an action. "Face your fears and take action" is my motto. It works for normal people, too.
And just think of all the successful people in history who were bipolar--possibly Winston Churchill and Abraham Lincoln, for example, not to mention the hordes of successful artists (if only posthumously) like Van Gogh. Our illness is as much a gift as a curse. It fuels my creativity, loosens my associations for writing, gives me extra energy when I must have it (though one always pays a price for such expenditures).
If you can pass for normal, you are for all intents and purposes normal, though I rarely informed an employer about my condition. Working as a doctor did successfully distract me from myself, even in depressions, as the morning wore on into afternoon and I started to feel a little bit like myself. Work is good. Freud defined mental health as the ability "to love and to work."
Luckily I have an incredibly supportive wife (a depressive unipolar) and unluckily, one daughter who is Bipolar I. But with help she got through UCLA in four years and now teaches HS biology. I am so proud of her!
As much as I hate to admit it, although the illness has come close to destroying my life, it has also enriched it immensely. It increased my compassion for others and was a touchstone for my art. Indeed more than a few of my poems have been inspired by dealing with the illness.
Can I say I'm a grateful bipolar? Almost. You know when you're doing good when you are grateful for your medications in the morning instead of resenting them, or at least accepting of their necessity.
There are worse diseases, though few as bad as a deep depression (I most recently had ECT in March of '08). But that treatment was also an action, though this time it did not help. Yet I made the decision and it was logical and endorsed by my doctors. Thus I do not regret it.
We are always in recovery, one might say. But to be in recovery we need to be engaged with the world and all it entails. For me the worst trigger is religion. Though I consider myself a Christian, church horrifies me--I always leave feeling guiltier than I came, like a worm before God. So I do not attend, which puzzles some of my Christian friends. But this avoidance is also part of my recovery.
(Those who are stuck do not tend to post at discussions like this, but maybe they will read them with profit.)
In the end we cannot deny our inherited illness, but we can certainly face our fears and take action. Yes, this is the third time I've repeated that mantra. Sometimes it merely boils down to not committing suicide. Sometimes it means taming your mania before it explodes. But it is an adventure peculiar to our disease, a quest, a trial, something that does have meaning--and many normal people lack meaning in their lives.
Good discussion!
Regards,
C. E. Chaffin M.D. FAAFP
Dr. Chaffin,
I'm curious as to your experience. For about 2 and a half years, and with my sponsor's OK, I tried relating to a couple of other bipolar women sort of as a sponsor because, knowing how much my life had improved, I had hoped that these women might see how my life had improved from applying education about the illness and my lifestyle changes and that this might encourage them to want to get unstuck. It didn't.
One woman still continues to refuse meds because she "likes her ups and downs," while the other continues to be paralyzed by her fears. I spent hours and days and weeks trying to work with this latter woman until, finally, when family crises hit me, I was already exhausted, depleted, and ill prepared to deal with my own life stresses so I had to cut free from this woman who takes relationships as all or nothing propositions. She continues to be angry with me for my finally having put my needs above hers in my life. I continue to feel sadness for her, but have to do what I have to do for myself because no one else can do it for me.
In discussing my changed relationship in regard to this women, I told my AA sponsor that I think the difference is that, in AA, newcomers and chronic relapsers are aware that there is a program of action to be bought into and that they repeatedly hear from those alcoholics who are in a one day at a time recovery, "If you want what I have, then do what I did," and that the foundation of AA is based on getting honest with self and with our individual Higher Power and at least one other member of AA (or clergyperson or therapist or any other "trusted other" human being). The women I was trying to help were not aware that I was inviting them, by example, to buy into any program of action other than what my experience, strength and hope might be offering them.
That, John, perhaps speaks to why those bipolar and depressed individuals in your experience with BDSA might simply disappear as they recover instead of sticking around to help others NO MATTER HOW MUCH IT MIGHT BENEFIT OTHERS. I am not personally acquainted with BDSA so I do not know if that group offers a program of action for recovery. Besides, even in AA, very many who recover also disappear and "go back to their lives." In fact, in my experience, it is a minority of people who continue to go and take an active part in service to others having the disease of alcoholism.
Yes, I need to socialize. For a long time AA meetings, group therapy, and get togethers and phone calls with the women I met there were my only forms of socialization. Yet I also am a person who requires a great deal of alone time -- in comparison with other people -- in order to stay centered. In order to maintain responsibility to myself, I have arrived at the conclusion that I can no longer allow any other human being -- including my immediate family members -- to chronically overtax my resources -- especially when those others seem to be claiming my time instead of focussing on their own self responsibility and personal growth.
I do not, however, take my new position with an attitude of judgement towards any one of my fellow bipolar sufferers. I, too, was stuck for many years and could not move forward. But, as we also say in AA, "I got sick and tired of being sick and tired."
I do not wish bipolar disorder on any other human being. Our lives are frequently miserable and lonely -- not to mention ruled by the stigma of mental illness which affected my own perception of my apparent inability to recover for most of my life (as much as it affected other people's view of me).
Even as I started to approach recovery, I was ruled by the fear that perhaps my pdoc and therapist might find me fit enough to return to work fulltime until I could no longer hide the results of recovery from them; in fact, they each asked me about the same time how I had gotten better. So I overcame my fear enough to discuss the situation with my therapist. What would he say when my next Social Security review came up? He replied that even though I had achieved a degree of stability, he would tell them that it was a very delicate stabillity. Once I had the courage to put that out into the open and hear his response, I was able to make peace with my illness, to accept it not as the primary definition of me, but as just one part of me.
Finally, I now have "an attitude of gratitude" not just for my disease of alcoholism, but also for my bipolar disorder. Both have enriched my life immensely. I would not be who I am today without BOTH illnesses!! As the Chinese proverbs says, "When the student is ready, the teacher will come." SO WHO OUT THERE IS READY TO MOVE BEYOND MISERY AND DESPAIR AND TOWARDS WHAT IT TAKES TO MOVE INTO RECOVERY?????
Elizabeth,
I applaud your journey. I believe the woman who exhausted your resources more likely has Borderline Personality Disorder rather than Bipolar Disorder, as her "all or nothing" attitude confirms.
Establishing boundaries is terrifically important to our disease; in depression we sometimes try to help others out of guilt; in mania, out of an overflow of power. But in stability and with perspective we can genuinely help--provided we do not violate our own needs for succor.
One thing about boundaries: one of the most important is our sleep cycle. A regular sleep/wake cycle is essential to recovery. Just a plane trip can mess us up.
Your courage inspires me.
Thine,
CE
I thought maybe i was crazy (haha!) while sitting in some CODA meetings I attended. When I was first diagnosed as bipolar the rest of my life was out of control, i.e. separation, health, etc., so my therapist said I should check it out. I went for about 8 weeks. At first I was like, "Wow! This is so great!" but after the 6th or 7th week it seemed like the same people showed up, made the same complaints, took all the blame, used the same buzzwords ("Well, I really played the caretaker role the other day"..."my boss took advantage of me and asked me to work on my day off, I couldn't say no"...) and never took any steps towards recovery. It seemed as though this was just part of their identity, and they could all get together and no one would call anyone out so they all got to just sit around and whine and mope but never do anything remotely painful by dealing with real issues. One of the CODA rules is "No cross talk" which is code for let the other person talk and no matter how much BS they were spouting you couldn't call them out on it. Nobody ever had a great week, made lots of progress, confronted a fear, stood up for themselves to their dependant, nothing. My last meeting I sat there listening to the same old "wah wah wah" and finally I said I had something to say. I asked them if it was possible to recover from whatever was ailing us. No answer. I told them how I felt that they were all just spinning their wheels and were stuck. I did not want to be stuck, I wanted to be better. My life sucked and I wanted it to not suck. I asked if any of them wanted to move on and improve their daily situations or keep living the way they were. That's what the whole 12 step thing is about. Well, they all stared at me, so I got up to leave. I apologized for being inappropriate and wished them all luck. So yes, I have seen others stuck in recovery, but me, hell no. Every day I get further from sickness an closer to wellness!! Be cool!
My computer wouldn't let me see all the comments on this, but from what I read, I seem to come from a different place.
I'm "stuck" all right. I don't really believe that I have this illness, even though I see the evidence all the time in my breakdowns/behaviour/fears/thoughts/sensitivities and on and on. My docs say it's Denial.
I take my meds, pretty much as prescribed....when I'm really in doubt I reduce them....but haven't been lately.... and never miss a meeting, either with the psych doc, therapist, or group.
I don't know how I can 'recover' from something I think I may be faking somehow. I know. That sounds crazy in itself. I feel that I am enslaved by my moods and emotions and there is little that I can do about that. This endless obsessive loop of thought has haunted me since my dx almost 4 yrs ago. My new pdoc suggests other medications to help with that and will discuss it with me next month. But really- I don't believe that medication can stop the irrational beliefs that I hold. (and see, I do recognize some distortion in my thinking).
I feel horrendous shame about all this, and I deeply regret giving in to the desperation that drove me to the doctors office in the first place. I feel stuck in quicksand. Funny about that....I had recurring nightmares of being stuck in quicksand as a child...
I realize that I'm going against the grain in this thread. Everyone is doing so well and working so hard to manage and stay stable. I feel like a fraud, and yet hopeless. Confusion Reigns!
mejeba,
Actually, you have taken the first step to getting unstuck by simply admitting that you are stuck!!! Pat yourself on the back for that!!! Remember that "a journey of a thousand miles begins with one step." Consider yourself on your way. You've made a crack in your denial already.
My question would be -- and I hope your computer lets you see this post -- why don't you believe you have this illness? You say you see all the evidence, that you take your meds, and that you make your appointments. That gives me the impression that you do have a small degree of belief at least. So why don't you believe you have it????
Trust me, you are not faking this!!!!!!!!! Maybe right now you are -- as I used to be -- enslaved by your moods and your emotions. But you don't have to live the rest of your life like that! You CAN learn to take one small step after another!!!! That's all it takes.
Meds alone didn't cut it for me. Meds + therapy + groups alone didn't cut it for me -- although each one is part of the puzzle. You can work with your therapist to challenge your own thought patterns. You can use your groups as a lab to practice new skills and thought patterns. They are a somewhat safe place to do so. But, at some point, you will have to change your lifestyle (living habits) to get the full benefit of the others. If you can manage it, try taking a walk for 20 minutes each day. If that sounds like too much, give a 10 minute walk a shot. And keep at it until it's easier for you.
Also, you say nothing about your anxiety level. I finally recognized that anxiety was playing a big -- and very separate -- role in my life so I tackled that first.
You are not going against the grain of this thread. You are asking for help from others who are no longer ashamed of their illness because they realize that THEY DIDN'T CAUSE IT. Neither did you.
I am probably way out of line about this (and, if I am, John, please say so), but I would at least consider adding some walking to your life and see how you feel about yourself a month after starting that new habit before I would agree to change to any medication change. Medication, while very important, is not a magic bullet. Is there some compelling reason other than that that your new doc has for wanting to change your meds?
Please recognize that I was hopeless for many, many years. If you can't believe that you will ever recover hope, please believe that I believe that you can!!
msr,
You go girl or guy! For having the courage to call out those CODA folks!!
In attending non AA 12 step meetings -- and even some AA groups -- it has been my experience that many are made up of people who are stuck which is why I would strongly suggest that everyone who is interested in learning a program of action attend several local AA meetings. Most meetings today are "Open" which simply means that you don't have to be an alcoholic to attend. (There are fewer "Closed" meetings which simply means that you identify yourself as being an alcoholic).
With your sense of growth orientation, you will be able to tell which meetings are also growth oriented. Give each group 6 weeks to decide for yourself if ANYONE in it seems to have good sobriety. After all, Webster's defines "sobriety" simply as "clear thinking." If anyone there does, they will surely be able to point you in the direction some quality meetings that might fit your schedule.
You have reminded me that even before I realized that I was an alcoholic (the binge drinking kind) I asked an AA woman I met in a psych group to be my sponsor and she agreed, helping me to make a beginning. You might want to consider that possibility, too. I would suggest, however, that if you decide to do that, follow the suggestion that is often given for the men to stick with the men and the women to stick with the women. This is only to keep sexual issues out of the picture and applies even if you are gay because each gender usually has more in common with members of its own gender than with others of the opposite gender.
A book you may find helpful/interesting is one I borrowed and can only remember the title, not the author: The Survivor's Guide to Bipolar Disorder.
You are DEFINITELY moving toward recovery!! Congratulations!!!
GeekStyle,
Thanks so much for your reply. I know I contradict myself all over the place: I see the evidence, do the work and still feel like a fraud. My tdoc gets quite exasperated with me.
You're right- anxiety is a huge problem for me. It seems like it's the source of these intrusive thoughts that consistently undermine my self-worth. I don't doubt for a moment that anxiety plays a big role in keeping me stuck.
I do find walking good, but have never been consistent. I have a hard time being consistent, I must admit.
I think I've become rather set in my dysfunctional ways. As a very young mother, I muddled through raising 3 boys, am a grandmother, and have never, in adulthood, felt like such a child. I truly cringe at some of my behaviours when my kids were young, but they say they're not damaged!
I appreciate your encouragement. I feel lost and hopeless so much of the time, like I'm going through the motions and have no future; like everything I'm doing is too little too late.
But again, you're right. admitting you're stuck is taking the first step, and right now it's baby steps.
Wow, what a perceptive question, although to you it may seem an obvious one.
I found myself having an epiphany of sorts recently- well, about a yr ago- but I guess it was more a sick shock than a real epiphany. Anyway, I realized that for my whole life, right back to early childhood, I've been living one lie after another, trying to be this person and that person, never finding a person I could call myself whom I could actually like, accept, respect, etc. I went through countless trials, faiths, beliefs, and experiments to that end until I finally fell apart enough to seek out medical help for the first time.
My youngest son had had his first full-blown manic/psychotic break almost 2 yrs before that and was very sick. My fear and grief for him and being strong for him, along with some other pretty heavy social/work stressors reduced me to a grovelling mess, knowing that I have something very wrong in my brain too, and wanting a psychiatrist to tell me what it is.
But- the instant the doctor said Bipolar Disorder, I believed that I'd tricked him somehow with my dramatic style of expressing myself when I'm upset or anxious, and what he explained was recognition at last, I was convinced was just me faking something again. In the meantime I took the meds, was already in therapy, and hoping that I'd find some peace.
Not so! Payback-time said my treacherous mind and I've been fighting with myself all the harder since then. Truth be told, I don't really believe that recovery is possible for me (have I said that already?), because I don't really believe that I can ever accept myself, and I don't really believe that I can know myself enough to accept. I'm so done with blind faith.
I'm so sorry to be whining on here. It's probably looking like a self-pity party!
mejeba,
I can SO relate to living a lie, etc.! Part way through my first hospitalization I came to that realization on a smoke break and my whole body started shaking uncontrollably for what seemed like forever. Looking back, I guess it might have been a complete anxiety attack.
So, OK, we lived a lie trying to be everything to everybody but ourselves. Beginning of the end of the story. We can change. Rather than stress about it, I would -- thanks to the hindsight I now have -- suggest it as a place to begin accepting yourself. (Actually, you already have. Go back and read your own post. I see acceptance in it -- just not what we might like to have to accept.) The hardest thing about learning to accept myself was that I had to accept imperfection, the bad as I judged it to be, that is part of the warts in loving someone "warts and all." It's a wart to live more for other people than for ouorselves.
I can even empathize with you about your son. My nephew was only 11 when he was diaganosed and my daughter -- now an adult -- is almost certainly an as yet undiagnosed bipolar. But see, there I go! We are NOT bipolar like we are somehow basically inferior. We have Bipolar Disorder. It is just one petal of the flower that is us. Another petal is being a mother, but do we say, "We are mother?" Of course not! We are women who have at least one child.
For years and years, I didn't think recovery was possible for me. I definitely had no role models, after all. But it was in taking those baby steps one at a time -- the meds, the docs, the groups, talking a walk each day -- and doing it even when I didn't feel like doing it -- which gave me a different focus until the evening of the epiphany I had -- that I was feeling joy from the inside out. And that gave me lots of motivation for pushing myself even harder, especially when I didn't feel like taking any of the progressively bigger and bigger baby steps.
Yes, our brains are different, but not -- or so I have come to believe -- weak! We are among the most intelligent and creative human beings on the face of the earth. Did you know that? Do you really think that Van Gogh could have worked a 9 to 5? But look at all the beauty he brought into the world!!! While I always strongly identified with the person in "The Scream," I now think that it is not just an existential scream, but an "I'm stuck in mania and can't get out" scream
Go ahead -- toss blind faith aside. It's really okay. My AA sponsor told me early in our relationship an AA truism -- we don't think our way into right acting; we act our way into right thinking.
Building a new life took me about 3 years; I have done a variety of things, from getting involved in a church and other community activities to serious dietary change to volunteer work and now, finally a part-time job. Each thing that I took on, gradually, made me stronger. It starts with attitude, but then we need some support to keep going. I wish that doctors or case managers or others had this model in mind; I seem to have amazed people with my "progress" which was mostly a 'do-it-yourself" process, but there has to be a better way to encourage this step-by-step endeavor. We need even more stress on recovery, which is popular today but still new to the treatment community where I live, but so far it is often a lot of platitudes rather than concrete steps or programs that encourage higher functioning. Consumers need to understand that change is gradual, requires effort and courage and is very much more possible than they have imagined.
Hi Again Everyone!
I just checked out the link in Dr. Chaffin's post. He mentions that he is a writer, but not that he is a poet! I've taken the liberty to copy -- and will paste -- one of the responses to his work which appears on that site:
"These are poems which point both south toward anxiety and north toward hope, keeping the compass needle moving. C. E. Chaffin is a doctor with a physician's keen objective eye. His poems employ a music jazzed and melancholy, with a strong sense of dislocation and a painterly sensibility that resonate in the mind's optic."
--Lynn Strongin, editor of "Sorrow Psalms" and "Crazed by the Sun"
Clearly his work speaks to the issue being discussed here. Haven't we all heard that journaling is therapeutic? Seems like Dr. Chaffin took that suggestion a bit further! I will buy it as soon as I can!
I often have asked myself, am I really ill? do I use my illness to make excuses to not work, to make excuses for my behaviour? I think I am in recovery but i feel stuck tool some days are bad, and I have to work hard at turning them around. I want to sleep well and I am not able. Have to run to the pills. I don ot like the medicine. I try to exercise, meditate, eat right, triying yoga. But it is such a struggle to be constantly doing somethng about the illness it is exhausting. I wish I could just let it be. When I am able to do this, i feel much better, do not think or am aware that I live with bipolar. It is so much easier that way, but very hard to do it. becuase it jumps in my mind. any suggestions to avoid this. I get so desperate sometimes, I make my ffiends and family go mad. I am thankful, a group of friends tolerate me, I am afraid they will get tired of me though. I have not attempted a relationship in 10 years now. I do not feel comfortable around a gentleman. very insecure and do not know how to behave. afraid my moods will jump in. will it work with another bipolar male. I dream, and watch the movies of mental illness with good endings. and i say to my self it is possible to have a relationship if you find some one with a big heart that will accept you and be strong enought to tolerate you with your illness. any ideas, or input? thans for the opprtunity given to write down my opinion. I do feel that I need to take responsability for my acts and th0ughts. need not make excuses. but it is a long life struggle. zeida
Oh, Zeidta, the pain you feel comes through your post loud and clear! I remember being there, too, and the world seems like a very dark place, doesn't it? You CAN recover, though! Believing that it is possible was a big part of the battle for me.
Remember, you are not your illness. Your illness is simply a part of you. So instead of doing the healthy things (like exercise) for youor illness, try doing them for YOU -- all of you!
My own view of excuses and responsibility is that we are not responsible for the problem behaviors it sometimes brings, but we ARE accountable for that behavior. Excuses, for me, were a way to avoid accountability for my behaviors.
As for relationships, I made a very conscious choice not to get into any. I've been out of them for longer than you have, too. It took more energy than I even had just to work on myself and do the best I could with my children. Now that they are grown, you know what? For the first time in my life, I feel complete within myself! I may or may not get into a relationship in the future, but not with anyone that I have not established a deep friendship with first. That's because, whenever I have become intimate with someone, it's almost an automatic selling of my soul and I don't want that any more. Also, I personally think -- at least for me -- that I will do better in a relationship with a caring and loving "normal" man. I don't think I would be able to stand the stress of lving with 2 people who have bipolar disorder! But that is just me.
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I should have realized that before. Thanks for your kind response. 
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Hi John, most of the time I don't give my Bipolar a second thought. My medication works well, sadly not everyone can say this. I take it 3 times a day, and if I'm not showing any symptons I go about my day like others. I see my Pdoc every 2 months for a med check. I do count myself as one of the lucky ones. I use to go to therapy, but they would tell me to come back when I needed them again. My husband is a very good support system. But he's the first to admit after 32 years of marriage, he still doesn't under what I deal with.
This is not to say that I don't still deal with depression, or with anger, or darkness...or anything else we live with. I just choose not to let it run my life. I've had this Disorder since childhood, and I am now 53. It's taken years to get to this point in my life. It's taken enough years away from as it is. I've had to teach myself new ways of thinking, and reacting to my Disorder. I try my best to stay on top of my feelings
Now I don't always win these battles. I still fall down into the depths of Bipolar, it just seems that I am more successful at winning now a days. I wish I had something to give to others. That they could learn from me, and skip the different stages of this illness. I wish there was this magic wand I could wave to stop this Disorder.
So anyways...I try not to get Stuck inside my illness!!
I related to much of what you wrote except the part about the talk therapist. I am fortunate to have found a therapist I can also call a friend. She does a great job of remembering details in my life and seems truly interested in how things are working out. (I live in a dysfunctional family not related to my BPD.) It helps to reduce the stress of daily living when I know I will see her every two months or so. My psydoc is in the same office so I have my med checks the same day. It's coming up on five years since I was hospitalized for mania (the lithiumwasn't enough to hold me in check anymore). I use a "Beam chart" I found on the internet (I think throught Mass General's psych site). It has proven to be invaluable especially for med adjustments.
The link to the Mood chart I find essential to staying on tract is:
http://www.psychiatry24x7.com/content/backgrounders/psychiatry24x7-nd.emea_com/blank_chart.pdf