Oh, yes - I remember these well! Most of the instances happened when I was a kid, but they also happened at work. One time, after talking to my boss about my co-worker, she told me to talk to him - then I found out that she talked to another person in the department, who then talked to my co-worker and confronted me with what I had said. When I told my boss that he already knew what I had told her, she swore up and down that she hadn't told anyone, "that she could remember," at least. Then she said she hoped it wouldn't damage our relationship and trust and I said I didn't know about that. Later, when I was going through a major depression, first she told me to take a few days off to get used to my medication, then later she more-or-less put me on "probation" and said if I didn't "get over it" she might have to do something she didn't want to and told me my depression was simply because of her giving my co-worker a promotion after I talked to her about him.
A previous boss I had, the day before his retirement, gave me a performance review and rated me as "excellent," but then threw in comments like I wasn't a "team player," etc. When I asked him who said that, he wouldn't tell me. He made a few more negative comments so, after ten minutes of this, I told him it was enough and walked out. In fact, I left for the day. The next day, at his retirement party, he talked about everyone in our small department but never mentioned my existence. After 16 years of working for him, I felt like I was punched in the stomach.
All of this did not help my genetic predisposition to depression, needless to say. But nobody "got it" or gave a damn; even the people who seemed to be sympathetic I couldn't completely trust because that's how things worked - they'd pretend to be "on your side" and then turn around and sell you out. This is the type of thing that made me decide to retire early, as soon as I had my "magic number," because I felt I would truly go insane if I stayed any longer. I didn't even realize how bad it was until I got out and I'm thankful every day that I don't have to ever go back there. Kind of sad after 35 years of working your ass off for a company, but I'm sure this goes on everywhere.
Wow Judy...
To think you lasted there 35 years! I cannot imagine. You should not have had to go through stuff like that. The workplace can be brutal. It is no wonder employees are not so keen on being loyal anymore...the moral of a company begins from the top down. If your boss was like that...then that sets the tone for the entire place. Good business doesn't equate with being mean.
I am just sorry you had to deal with years of that sort of thing. I bet you feel free now.
Thanks for sharing your experience with us.
Back when it was still legal to discriminate against female employees, I was an insurance adjuster. All the male adjusters got a company car. There were no female adjusters except the ones that took reports over the phone. That's what I was doing and I hated it. I wanted a company car and the claims that would take me out of the office. I went to the boss, a real s.o.b. by reputation, and told him I wanted to apply for an opening as an outside adjuster. He said, "Does your daddy know that you want to go there and go in the houses of black people and Mexicans. There's no telling what might happen to you." So it wasn't just women he discriminated against. Man, I'd like to get his ass in a sling with the law...but he died of a heart attack a couple of years later. I felt utterly humiliated. Of course he took me in his office and shut the door when he expained that only men (white men) were allowed outside jobs and a car and a much better salary than I would ever get. To kind of gloss over what he had done, he did sent me to a multi-line insurance adjuster's school for a few weeks, where I learned how to do a lot of damage estimates on houses, roofs, cars, etc., that I would never be allowed to do in reality.
I had another lovely male boss when I was in the florist business. I was discriminated because I had told my supervisor I had sz and depression (I needed accommodation in order to see my psychiatrist and therapist regularly.) She told him, of course, and I understand that. But then when she blamed me for the store losing money (which was in no way my fault) and he backed her 100%. I could either quit or be fired. The weird thing was I scored higher than anyone in the region by secret shoppers -- I was great at customer service. So this was a double-bind situation. As in yes, you are great at your job, but you are responsible for our drop in sales. I still don't understand that one.
I am a victim in a relationship where this kind of communication is the norm. I never know if my partner is serious or joking or what exactly is the message. This is becoming more and more difficult and more and more stressful for me now that I have learned that I am an ACoA. Now that I am attending therapy and become aware of the fact that I have tolerated and even accepted this abusive behavior as normal in the past, I am now becoming less and less tolerant. I have realized that I deserve to be treated better and do not deserve this.
I have yet to act on this. I am trying to approach my partner and make them aware of this verbally abusive trait and trying to help work thru it with them and change this, since we have been together for 18.5 years. But,...This is not working. It seems to be easy to slip right back into the same old rut.
I have also found that since I was diagnosed with RA 3 years ago, my partner has treated me worse. It seems that the worst I feel, the worse my partner treats me. I used to just accept this treatment as normal. I have always been talked to in this manner, since I was raised by an alcoholic father and a mother who battles mental health issues. But,...now that I am learning from my therapist (since March of this year), this behavior is causing problems, since I am not about to just go along with it very well any more.
I may have to end this relationship. It is something that I know I may have to face, but don't want to. I am also aware that this is my biggest "trigger", sending me into a depressive nose dive.
Hi Rena
Your comment breaks my heart. You are such a kind, compassionate, wonderful person...you never ever deserve any sort of abuse. I can understand...if you had dealt with this in childhood...you grow up to not understand that...this isn't normal. This is not the way to be treated. But after so much time...I can see where this would be such a major undertaking to change things. But I want to tell you that...it is not too late.
I am so glad you have a good therapist and support. This is a huge thing. I really hope you find the peace and happiness you deserve. Please let us know how things are going along this front...okay?
We really care about you and I am just sorry to hear you have been dealing with this for so long.
Hi Merely Me,
This is certainly an interesting topic... but I also think it is a danger zone. I mean, I don't know if it is just me but I get confused sometimes between reality and what happens in my head. Based on my emotions inside I can misinterpret other people's body language, dismissing what they are saying and presuming that they mean something entirely different.
Yes, it does happen at times - people trying to manipulate, trick, being sneaky with their insults.. but if we look out for these double-bind comments we can increase our paranoia and delusions, I fear... or maybe I'm just projecting some of my own problems onto the populace at large. It's been known to happen, hahaha.
I'm a little tired right now and should probably be in bed but I'm going to come back tomorrow and read some other people's comments because this is definitely a fascinating topic. Night.
This is a good point Lyra.
Yes it is easy to get paranoid and misinterpret things said or people's gestures and tone. I guess when you feel it in your gut...it happens consistently...then you kinda know...that person is doing the double bind thing. I usually give people multiple chances but..over time you just know.
Thanks for your comment...you are a smart cookie.
hi
I went to group therapy today
Im almost ready not to go back
The boss there is always Right.
or at least Im always wrong
I am weak today
I have trouble enough walking and talking
I just cant deal with her
I feel despondent
Another thing is the land lord thing
His help works at any or all hours of the days
Jon
Very paranoid
Hi Jon
When you say "the boss" who are you meaning? Is this the same person you were having trouble with previously?
It can be scary to feel paranoid...it is absolutely not a good feeling. Is there anything which makes you feel safe?
I hope it helps to talk about it at least. Stay with us and keep writing.
hi MM
They call her the staff
I dont know what title she is called by
She is the same one
she is mean I think she is trying to practice "tough Love"
I really dont see it
The socalled friend I hung around brought me alot of trouble
He was from the special class
The counselors in school were trying to get to him thru me
Actually the whole thing reminds me of being evaluated in the hospital
im tired
Jon
I experienced this the entire time I worked in male-dominated fields as I am a woman. Really we all knew they hated me for being there but they didn't want to get in trouble for saying so. It is SO crazy-making. This is when I began taking anti-depressants, migraine medication, and dangerously self-medicating. They said so many mean horrible things in that double-blind way. The few other women I talked to experienced it too so I know I wasn't imagining it. Most wanted to leave but knew they couldn't make the same money in other occupations.
Hello Badfish
May we ask...what occupation were you in? This seems to be a theme in the comments today from women working in male dominated fields. I have tended to see this type of communication most in families.
I am so sorry you had experienced this. It can definitely take a toll on one's psyche.
Thank you for sharing.
I found this very interesting but cannot think of any recent examples. But I know my grandmother who brought me up; did this to me. Especially the withdrawal body language. I can't remember any form of affection that she showed me. Saying one thing and then showing another.
Hi Anne
I think most people have experienced this form of communication in one way or another. When it is consistent and does not let up...I feel it does have the potential to cause a lot of psychological damage.
I am sorry your grandmother was this way. Every child deserves affection and to be loved...something so simple to give. It was unfair to you...an innocent child.
Thank you for sharing this example with us.
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My (ex)husband constantly gave me double-bind messages, although not always verbal. He would want sex constantly, then he would complain when I tried to initiate it. He would tell me what he wanted for breakfast, then tell me yes that's what he wanted if I had only cooked it right. No-win situations. He praised me for my athletic abilities, then got mad when I was able to out-perform him. He wanted me to buy clothes for him, then he always sighed and said no, that wasn't what he meant. He asked me to wash his socks then told me, "I would tell you how to do it right, but I know you couldn't remember what I said," after I finished. It was this constantly. Every day. Every time we were in the same room together. And it was during the 12th year of our marriage that I finally went bonkers. I had a complete breakdown and started a long journey back. Without him. That's the only way I could have kept from killing one or both of us. He totally destroyed my self-image and my self-confidence. No wonder I felt paranoid about going out in public.
Oh my Donna
I am so glad you got out of such a relationship. What you are describing is abuse. This sort of thing would drive anyone over the edge. Was he ever sorry for this type of treatment? Not that it matters as abusers quite frequently apologize but then keep doing the same thing.
I am just very happy for you that you have your freedom and don't have to put up with that any more.
Good to see you. I will try to catch up here. Hope you are doing well this week!
Ten years after we divorced, he contacted me. Sent a Christmas card. A couple of months later he sent a typed letter outlining all the things he had done wrong and what he would do right if I would give him another chance. But he actually showed no real signs of remorse. He referred to his abuse mostly in general terms and never reassured me that he had stopped cross-dressing, the worst of his preferences. We emailed each other for about a year. He sent flowers, gifts, cards, but I never agreed to meet him for coffee (or anything else.) Finally, I guess he caught on that I never intended to see him again. And we haven't written each other in about 2 yrs. I took his address out of my email addresses page so that if he writes again, it will go to my spam folder.
Btw, I am doing well, thank you. Have you set a date for gallbladder removal yet?
I am glad you got away Donna. No remorse after all of that? Not good. Maybe he isn't capable? No excuse but...sometimes you wonder about people. If they didn't get it then...they will never get it.
Gallbladder? What gallbladder? :>) I am very bad. I have not scheduled my test. I guess that attack is over but I realize it will come again. As the nurse told me...you don't want this to happen over Thanksgiving or something like that. So...okay...I should make these appointments. As winnie the pooh would say..."Oh bother."
Thanks for asking Donna.