The Depression Connection Question of the Week!

Eight free sessions?  Wow...that is super good. 

Let's see...for me...had to pay a $700 deductible which would cover seven of the ten sessions that my insurance would cover 80 percent...so really they would only cover three at 80 percent and then....fifteen sessions at fifty percent...and I would be limited to 25 sessions.  So...at a hundred bucks a pop for therapy (and this is cheap by today's standards) That would be...upwards of fifteen hundred dollars out of pocket for therapy...for 25 sessions.  Which...may be totally worth it if the therapy was helpful but if not...that is something to think about. 

Hi Pat

I think you have been a very pro-active patient in trying to find ways to help yourself.  I applaud your efforts!

I think a lot of people are doing things like cutting pills in half...some are stopping their meds completely because they can't afford them.  This is a growing problem...that people simply cannot afford to be well.  Not sure what the answer is except to keep trying to make do with the system in place.

Thank you for your thoughts and input...and you are hardly insignificant...you are very important here. 

Pat, I did some research on SuperTinitis and found some interesting reading at

http://www.matttelfer.com/page6.htm

There is a lot of information about tinnitus, associated symptoms and treatment that I have not included. If your tinnitus is a problem I would strongly recommend thoroughly reading all the information available on these links. www.tinnitus.org www.cst.eu.com

Hope this has some information that helps - I learned a lot!

I really appreciate the gesture and I am already aware of the available treatments for tinnitus. Julian Cowan Hill is just another person that is making millions of dollars of of this affliction. Cranial sacral therapy can run in the thousands of dollars for 1 visit and there is no guarantee. TRT, though it is thought to be the most effective treatment is very biased about whom they will treat as far as my knowledge goes. I have known that my tinnitus is a nervous system disorder for more than 6 months now. The problem is that there is nothing that I can afford to do about it. At best this is how I spend my day.

I wake up and realize that my nerves are still pulsating and then I judge the noise in my head. I immediately take an allergy pill to clear out my sinuses. I have a cigarette and try to figure out how much farther away from the rest of the world I am. All I know is that I am on my own. No matter what anyone says, they can never relate to the crap that my body puts me thru. And I totally understand that it could be worse, but again you have to debate the issue of quality of life. I have struggled to bring myself back from a very manic state. I have taken steps to remove foods from my diet that probably caused this, foods that I enjoyed. I have tried exercise, meditation, counseling, antidepressants. I have used every dam vitamin out there.

I also have to face the fact that my dads mom had serious mental health issues and alzhiemers was a part of that. This is the World I know.

Pat

Pat,

Please realize that we all live in our own private hell before we are successfully treated for our depression. While no one can truly appreciate "your" hell, many of us can appreciate the fact that you are experiencing it.

Your quality of life is going to be a fight for you, but that fight will never be won if you give up on yourself. I gave up on myself 20 years ago - imagine my disappointment when I screwed up killing myself THREE times.You would be appalled at the measures I took - I am.

You have a double-edged problem. You are dealing with depression and a constant ringing in your ears. If you weren't crazy already, that ringing would get you there.

So, what are your options? I don't know, but you can be pretty sure you have some. You just have to find them!

Call your county mental health board and get that ball started to start receiving therapy and determine your medication needs, if any.The government moves slowly so you have to just resign yourself to that fact and keep telling yourself over and over, "You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar."

Start contacting every tinnitis organization and big pharma and ask them about funding to treat the unisured and under insured. Ask about treatment trials that you might participate. What trade are you in, maybe you could propose a barter arrangement for treatment. If you are in an area with a medical school - volunteer to be a trial patient.

Find a support group and become part of it.

Be proactive and be persistant. Be nice to the people you talk with in your inquiries. While they may not have anything for you when you call, if something comes across their desk and you were nice to them and not screaming your frustrations, they will remember you and call you with the new information or an opportunity to be in a trial.

Learn you options and stay informed about your condition. Go to the library and reseach, not just the internet - a university library is second best to a medical school library. (Have a Taber's Medical Dictionary handy for referencing words you don't know)

You are going to get a lot of "NO's" - be prepared for that mentally. For every no you recieve you are that much closer to finding a "YES"!

Use venues such as this to vent your anger, try to avoid taking it out on some underpaid receptionist or switchboard operator - they really are abused and it isn't fair to them.

Try and stay focused on the goal - getting the care that you need for your mental health and your tinnitis. Making a list of things to do and checking that list off will help you to see that you are accomplishing things, even if you did not get the answers you wanted that day.

Get your mental health issues addressed and managed - that can effect every other condition you have and make them significantly more symtomatic.

Add to your To Do list... find something everyday that makes you laugh, anything at all to get a chuckle out of yourself.

And don't forget to tell your wife everyday that you love her and thank her for being there to support you.

Post here about what you are doing and what you learned that day as to what was affective and what was not.

Hi Gina

It is frightening to think about isn't it?  Things just have to change as far as health care goes.  It just isn't working.  It is a real crisis and you and your husband are but one example of so many...who are forced to worry if you will be able to pay your medical bills in the future. 

My heart goes out to you.  I don't know what the answer is but...I am hoping for change. 

Thank you so much for sharing here.  Your thoughts are much appreciated.

I am sorry to hear about the problems you and your husband are having with your health, but there are several options available to you. If you are waiting on a "public option" for health care insurance, you are in for a sad awakening. Please take the time to actually read at least one of the many bills floating around Washington right now. This is not the venue for politics, but if you are unhappy with Medicare, why do you feel a public option would be any better?

If your husband is being forced to retire because of health issues, he should be able to apply for disability and get his medicare started. You must do that now, because the government moves very slowly and you will probably have to hire an attorney to appeal the decision because they routinely deny the first application.

COBRA is an extension of your coverage offered through your employer that you pay 100% of the premium. You can always apply through the current company for benefits, but if you have health problems they may consider the risk too high.

Back to Medicare. You can purchase a good medicare suppliment policy for far less than you are paying in COBRA payments and still pay out of pocket for your mental health care. You must then ask yourself if the psychiatrist is doinging anything more than managing your meds and if you might have better results in a different therapy environment. It is something to talk about with your doctor.

Furthermore, many big pharma companies have programs that people can financially qualify for to get their medication free.

The problem with Medicare is that fewer and fewer doctors are accepting medicare patients because the reimbursements are constantly being cut. If Congress makes another cut next year, the availability of medical care for seniors will decline dramatically.

I don't carry medical insurance - this is my choice. The cost of insurance vs the amount of money I spend each year, don't compare. I have a savings account I pay my medical "premium" into each month. I am looking into a catastrophic plan, though, as a safety net.

Finally, you must consider where you live in relation to your cost of medical care. It may be time to consider a change of scenery. States like Texas that have tort reform have lower health care costs.

We live in the greatest country in the world and have the best medical care in the world. The cost of that privilege is personal responsibility. Just like we learn in thearpy we are responsible for our own happiness. So it is up to you and your husband to make the decisions that are in your best interest, not the government, not your children, and not your doctors.

Do your homework - the research is also good to help you stay focused on what is important. Shutting down will not make the problem go away - I am the president of that club! Find something you are passionate about and just go for it. The hardest thing to do is step out the front door, but once out and with a plan in place, you will feel better - this I can promise you.

If you are shutting down, then you need to talk to your doctor about that and what can you do together to get past it - be it a change in medication, an adjustment, an addition, or justing giving the current stuff time to work.

As you know, you are not alone in the ongoing battle with depression. You are fortunate in a twisted sort of way that your husband suffers from depression too - at least he understands. Often times we don't get that support with the understanding.

I live next door to my dad - if I go into a funk I hide and make excuses not to come over if I cannot bring myself to put on a happy face. We often times live a lie to the outside world and that is so draining, emotionally and physically. You have to figure what motivates you and use that information.

Nonamenoface...

I am very curious about your decision to not have any health insurance.  How is that working for you?  What factors led to this decision?

My opinion is that all the personal responsibility in the world is not going to grant some folk...medical care. 

I feel that a healthy discussion about health care reform is a good thing.  But beyond the rhetoric...what can people do now who are in need of mental health or medical care and cannot afford it?

Thank you for your insights...they are much appreciated.

Initially my decision not to have health care was one of economics. To maintain an individual policy would have been in the neighborhood of $800 per month in VA. I had been bare for almost a year before my financial situation was were I was able to look at insurance again. When I broke down the numbers, it was really cost prohibative and an MSA made more sense for ME - it is not a wise choice for everyone. Considering I am in reasonably good health and I have already had my appendix, gallbladder, and uterus removed it limited the probability of an unexpected surgery.

In the year that I was without insurance I broke my big toe, tore ligaments in my ankle, and while I was at it ripped the toenail off half way. I had out patient surgery to remove the toenail, xrays, and an air cast for less than it would have cost for two months of premiums. I pay $20 for 90-day supply of my Synthroid and Prozac (generics). It was $90 per year to do my thyroid blood work and $40 for an office visit. Many physicians will charge you a lesser price for cash patients, in fact I insist upon it. There is no reason a doc can't give you Medicare allowable, or even BCBS allowables. (The reasoning behind that is that if I had insurance he would have to file and wait for his money and then write off the disallowed amounts anyway- all that cost the practice money. If I pay cash up front, then he doesn't have to wait for payment, have the expense of filing the claim and maybe have to do followup, or any other number of things that insurance companies do to delay payments.)

So all in all, it has been a financial advantage not to have insurance. Since moving back to Texas I have searched again for health insurance. $5K deductibles, $10K max out of pocket and $40 and $50 copays for about $400 a month. OR I can pay less than $50 per month for hospitalization and an MSA with the same $10K max out of pocket and not pay taxes on the contributions.

My pre-existing conditions are less likely to cause me to be hospitalized than other medical problems.

In Texas I am guaranteed insurance with a minimum of 2 people on the plan and they do pooling and that helps keep the rates down. Some states are as few as one, and other states don't have laws in place.

You are correct in your statement that all the personal responsibility in the world does no good if you can't afford health insurance and needs it. I see too much selfishness and irreposnibility not to believe that if one can't afford something, then you have to make changes. I work two jobs, one during the week and one on the weekends. My part-time job pays for my luxuries, my full time job I am an independent contractor and pay all my own taxes - if I don't work I don't get paid - that money goes toward everything that is a necessity. Jobs at McDonalds and 7-11 have benefits, so if one is able to work, they can get insurance if they need to get insurance. It's the small businesses that have few employees that can't afford the benefits for their workers.

On the other hand, if one cannot afford their health care, then there are clinics through social services that are funded to care for those that can't afford it. No one is turned away from any emergency room legally in the USA, that cannot be said for medical facilities under a national health care plan.

Furthermore, it is not even the federal government's place to provide health care to everyone and/or mandate that everyone have a healthcare plan that they approve.

Our Consitution clearly states it is the federal government's responsibility to provide for the national security and PROMOTE the welfare of the people. The Bill of Rights gives us the right for the pursuit of happiness, it guarantees nothing about finding it.

If any state wants to have a state health plan, it is within their authority for the voters to decide, but not the federal government. Medicare is going to be bankrupt in 8-10 years, Social Security is not far behind, and the VA medical system is a string of horror stories. The government cannot run anything efficiently, it is impossible. The only thing they do well is our military, as our forefathers planned our system of government to do.

The reform needs to come by the way of the insurance companies. Things like tort reform make significant progress in lowering the cost of health care. The federal government is not going to even address tort reform because they would lose the support of the lawyers.

We cannot continue to surrender our liberties. Our country was founded on the pioneering spirit and we have the intrinsic ability to accomplish what needs to be done when we have to - where there is a will, there is a way. It might require thinking outside the box, it might require a venture to unfamiliar territory, but we have the resources available to every American to read and research and be informed. It is our civil responsibility.

As people suffering with depression, we know better than most what it is to struggle to get out of bed - taking a shower and dressing for work is yet another hurdle when we are in a funk. But that also gives us an insight that many don't have - we know how to work for what we want to accomplish. It is never easy, but it can be done. And the more we do it - the better we get at it!

I took my own advice today and called my doctor about changing my meds or adding to what I am taking. I told him what was going on and that this time I wasn't going to take no for an answer and I wasn't going to come in and pay him $50 for him to write the scrip. He just said OK - I was all ready for an argument, but I had prepared my statement and covered all the bases and he said OK! I am going to his office in the morning to pick up some samples to try and we would start from there. I forgot what he is giving me but it starts with an R and I will take it at night and it will help me sleep - the first couple of days it may make me feel like I have a hangover but after that I shouldn't have any side effects. I am very pleased - guess it just took me making a reasonable argument instead of whining. Score one for the crazy woman!

No name no face...

I really appreciate your insights and commentary.  Of course there are many points which could be debated but I will leave that to our members. 

I am thinking we all really won't know what will happen until it happens.  Anything else is pretty much conjecture at this point. 

I do hope you get meds which help you and also...I hope you get your sleep patterns back.  May I ask...have you been diagnosed with depression or Bipolar Disorder? 

Keep writing here...like I said...you have much to offer!

My official dx is major depression - I am thinking it is bipolar disorder. If I am bipolar, I would appreciate being manic more than depressed - I get a lot more accomplished during my manic periods!

I love a good HONEST debate. I love to learn new things and hear new idea - I may not agree with them, or I may question my own beliefs and start digging for more information to confirm or dispell. America is great - we don't have to agree - but having the right to disagree is pretty powerful in itself.

I am really looking forward to starting my new medication tonight. I was up until almost 6am, then woke up again at 10am. Even my dogs are giving me dirty looks for waking them during my night time activities! On the plus side all my laundry is done, sheets changed, dusted, mopped, and cleaned out my car.

Hi again No Name No Face!

I am not a therapist but...I am wondering if some of these things you are telling us could potentially be Bipolar behavior...especially the great disruption in sleep.  And you are "on" right now...with your mind churning out many ideas.  It can be a time of great creativity and energy but there are also precautions one needs to take during a more manic time.  It might be good to bring this up with your doctor to ensure that you get the right treatment.

Here is a link to our Bipolar site here on Health Central.  There is a lot of information and support there as well.  They could also probably tell you more about sleep issues.

Would love to hear more about your experiences...I hope you keep sharing!

Thank you for your advice.  It really gave me some perspective on options available.  You are right about thinking that health reform will help.  The government isn't too generous about most things.

I have actually been thinking about what I could get involved in that would spark a passion.  Multiple Sclerosis, Alzheimers.  It is hard, but ideas are coming.  That's where it all starts.  I want to write book - an inspiritional one about how we managed life with multiple conditions.

Thank you for helping to channge my woes into more constuctive thought.  I liked your ideas.  Gina

If you ever need an opinion about something - I am your go to gal - I have an opinion about just about everything! LOL

Your book idea sounds great. Check with your local community college or university and ask them about the free auditing of classes for Seniors - you won't get credit hours, but they probably have classes that would help you on your way to start writing that book. There are a lot of people out there that would certainly benefit.

I would love to hear about your progress. Maybe even start your own blog and share with others some of the trials and tribulations and how you overcome them. Very inspiring stuff!

Hi Gophermom!

I am so sorry that you have been without health insurance for so long.  I did write an article some months ago that you might want to take a look at...about how to get mental health services when you have no insurance or money.  Just follow this link.

We will all see what the future brings.  I hope it is good for everyone!

I know...me too Judy. 

I am trying to hold off expressing my personal viewpoints and let members share their stories and opinions.  It is important to listen and...see where people are coming from. 

Hope...is the main thing here...I am hoping that things will get better.  We have a long way to go when it comes to health care.

Thank you Judy for sharing your opinions here.  

Hi there

I have to say...I am very impressed with your comment.  You are a person who has found the good in a potentially very bad situation.  I applaud you for your attitude and efforts. 

There are some, however, who will not be to cope with their depression without some help....and so many do not know how to find this help especially if they have no money or insurance.  I am grateful for your suggestions here.  These tips just might help someone who needs it. 

Thank you!

Hi Martha!

I think your thoughts echo many who are frustrated with the health care system here in our country.

I am hoping things will get better. 

Every person should have health insurance in this country... if they want it or can afford it.... check out the link below

http://www.pjtv.com/video/Louder_With_Crowder/_PJTV_Undercover%3A_Steven_Crowder_Investigates_CanadaCareWill_ObamaCare_Be_Any_Better%3F/2153/

Unfortunately, the taxes we are paying are not enough to fund everything our wise politicians think the government should get involved in. Things like the marsh mouse in San Francisco, and farting cows seem to demand funding, but heaven forbid we get to keep the money we earned and decide how it would best be spent for us individually.

The income tax in Canada is 56% and the sales tax is over 12-15%. Even with all that, Canadians have to come to the USA for treatment - often time life saving treatment. One has to be on a waiting list for 3+ years just to get a primary care physician.

Passing tort reform has been a huge factor in TX for lowering healthcare costs. In 1987 in FL, OBGYN's paid 1 million dollars a year for malpractice insurance. ER's had to close their doors because they could not afford the insurance.

Tort reform and the anti-trust laws need to be enforced to start. In TX you can't be denied coverage - you may have to pay out the nose for it if you have serious pre-existing conditions, but you can't be denied. Mental Health benefits are definitely lacking. Being able to customize your plan to your individual needs is another factor that would help manage costs. You shouldn't have to pay for maternity coverage if you aren't having a baby.

Offering people tax credits for their insurance premiums instead of charging them tax if you have too much or not enough is a far better for the tax payers.

Thank you so much for this well reasoned and articulate comment! 

Let's run with the idea you have at the end...tax credits.  Or just credits in general...do you feel that there could be some sort of monetary incentive to keep people healthier in the long run?  Like for example:

*Give me a break on my insurance if I improve my blood sugar readings (if I'm diabetic) or blood pressure (if I've got hbp).

* Give me a credit card that gives me more money back for medications if I buy foods that are lower in fat.

*  Give me a store credit at the supermarket if I buy heart healthy foods.

*  Give me a break on my insurance if I join a gym and show up so many days a month.

Trying to think of how this might work with mental health but you get my gist.

You had talked about personal responsibility...do you think incentives like this would work or backfire?

I am a firm believer in the KISS principal. One has to consider the administration of such incentive programs. Above the cost, there is the fact that one would have to release a considerable amount of private information to someone else to manage.

What if we looked at health insurance like car insurance - if you don't make a claim or have minimal claims, you get a reduction in your deductible as an incentive and/or your rates are lowered, that might be a viable consideration with limited transfer of information.

The thing to remember is that some actuary with a really big brain is taking all the numbers and putting them together to set rates that will maintain the profitability of the insurance companies. Healthcare cost rise because the cost of delivering that care increases. In the scheme of things, the insurance companies and the attorneys are the only ones maintaining their profit margins. The big pharmas spend millions of dollars on research and development - without that research we would not have the progress in medications we have today. When they price a brand medication, that price must cover the cost of the development of that medication before the patent runs out and the generics are allowed.

Health care is available for those that cannot afford it through the county health departments. Problem is that they are understaffed and under funded which means the quality of care is less than what one would receive at the local hospital in the ER. So patients come into the ER for the baby's ear infection, or that diabetic wound that won't heal and instead of the cost of care being a $100, it becomes $1200, or more.

Everyone complains about that $5 aspirin on their hospital bill - consider what it cost to deliver that aspirin. A physician has to order the aspirin, a nurse has to put the request into the hospital pharmacy, the pharmacist has to dispense it into that little plactic cup, a tech has to take it to the floor, and an RN has to give it to you. The RN is making about $60K, the tech about $12hr, the pharmacist about $100K. The malpractice insurance is a major expense plus general overhead. Salaries cost an employer about 1.5 times the actual salary with benefits, worker's comp, matching social security, etc. So the aspirin that probably cost the hospital a couple of pennies now cost the patient $5 and the hospital is probably taking a loss.

Consider the amount of money that is involved in things such as medicare and medicaid fraud, food stamp fraud, and welfare fraud. I have no idea of the actual number, but I would venture to guess it is millions if not billions.

Now consider if that money was used to prevent fraud and to give people a hand UP instead of a hand OUT. The federal government sucks at being efficient. Local governments are better equip to deal with indigent care within their own districts. Problem is that is riddled with fraud as well. So that takes us back to personal responsibility.

People with depression have a lot of insight into multiple societal problems if we think about it. We each have developed ways in which to cope with our illness and remain contributing members of our family and society. To continually enable people to be dependent upon the government for their basic needs is no different than being an enabler for someone that is co-dependent. Not very health for anyone.

Self esteem with the sense of accomplishment would do more for the poor than continuing to give them hand outs. I am a firm believer in workfare, not welfare for that very reason. Take away the incentives of those that abuse the system and make available better and more comprehensive services for those that need the temporary help - without taxing everyone to death. For those that are permanently disabled, then the funds would be availbale to help them maintain their quality of life.

Our founding fathers were wise beyond their time and understood the woes of big government. An argument often heard in the healthcare debate is that it is morally wrong not to provide healthcare insurance for all. The moral delima is that we don't provide people with the tools to enable them to purchase their own health insurance. The old adage - give a man a fish he will eat for a day - teach a man to fish and he will eat for a life time.

I am a very stong proponent of mental healthcare benefits reform. Traditionally mental health and substance abuse benefits have been quite limited. Mental health is an illness, not a fleeting condition and should be added as a medical condition when applicable. Family therapy, marriage counseling, etc can stay under the limited mental health coverage under most plans.

The end of my 2 cents.