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What should I eat?
Cris Frasineanu
Wednesday, October 14, 2009 at 04:02 PM -
II diet vs GL or GI diet
Karen LaVine
Wednesday, October 14, 2009 at 11:54 PMIf minimizing post prandial insulin production is as important as controlling post prandial BG, then why doesn't Dr Brand-Miller recommend a diet where the greatest percentage of calories are from fat with just enough protein to meet minimum requirements and just enough carbs for a few servings of veggies?
re: II diet vs GL or GI diet
David Mendosa
Thursday, October 15, 2009 at 12:06 PMDear Karen,
I don't know. But I am certainly heading that direction myself.
David
re: II diet vs GL or GI diet
RobLL
Thursday, October 15, 2009 at 01:32 PMAha - re-inventing Dr Bernstein!
re: II diet vs GL or GI diet
Cris Frasineanu
Thursday, October 15, 2009 at 07:54 PMBecause Mrs. Miller did not have the chance to study the the insulin index of all foods yet. Studying the insulin index of foods that do not contain carbs requires a different methodology. Maybe sometimes there are financial and time resources involved..or their absence. And sometimes I think that many more studies of drugs are performed compared to diet studies because drugs can pay the investment back, but informing people what to eat does not repay the study investment so much.
Besides, there are a lot of foods in the world and it takes time and resources to test the insulin response of 15 persons for each food.
Maybe a very very rich person with diabetes or insulin resistance will pay for such a research :)
re: II diet vs GL or GI diet
Gretchen Becker
Saturday, October 17, 2009 at 09:06 AMI think people, even scientists, become invested in one point of view and have difficulty admitting that they were wrong. Brand-Miller was endorsing a low-fat, high-carb diet and to now say that high-fat is good would be admitting she was wrong.
re: re: II diet vs GL or GI diet
Cris Frasineanu
Sunday, October 18, 2009 at 04:12 PMI read Mrs. Miller's book New glucose revolution and it said to always eat low glycemic index foods and mix the other foods with low glycemic ones, I did not understand she promoted high-carb low fat, in fact she promoted high good-fat (containing Omega 3). I think the insulin index will not contradict so much of what she promoted, maybe it will only add a few more foods on the list of not-so-good foods for insulin response.
re: re: re: II diet vs GL or GI diet
Gretchen Becker
Sunday, October 18, 2009 at 05:13 PMI think she modified the diet with time.
The version I had told people with diabetes to calculate how many carbs they ate, and then she said, "In fact, the more carbohydrate you eat, the better, because it automatically reduces the proportion of calories you get from fat."
Later she said, "As we have said constantly throughout this book, it is important to eat a high carbohydrate low fat diet."
I agree she urged that the carbs should be low GI. That was the whole point of the book, and in helping to develop the concept of the GI, she performed a great service.
And she may have changed her diet recommendations in later editions of the book. I know she wrote papers with Loren Cordain, who supports a low-carb, high-protein "Paleo" diet.
re: re: re: re: II diet vs GL or GI diet
Cris Frasineanu
Sunday, October 18, 2009 at 05:22 PMYou may be right, I do not have early versions of the book. The problem with proteins is now that they might lead to an increased insulin response. In the absence of more research about insulin index, I think the solution is the one promoted by David Mendosa/used for himself : only low carb veggies and good fats and that's it. Nothing else.
PS. Please excuse my language mistakes, I am from Romania, English is not my mother tongue and also, sometimes, I forget to correct them.
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Untitled Comment
Sue B
Thursday, October 15, 2009 at 03:57 PMThis is the first that I've heard of the food insulin index. It makes so much sense to me! My doctor says I have type II, but I can't take drugs - even if I wanted to - because my bs drops so low on its own. I've been trying for 3-4 years to control my bs with diet, yet there were times that I've not understood why it would go so low after eating. Grilled chicken on a salad would drive me hypoglycemic in less than an hour, and until I read this article I couldn't understand why.
Thanks.
Sue B
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insulin index and protein
barb
Monday, November 09, 2009 at 06:23 AMafter giving up all sugars and sweeteners and grains (mostly wheat) in april and losing about 15 lbs, I plateaued....the nutritionist had also wanted me to cut out all animal protein and dairy as well... I compromised and reduced it to 2 oz animal protein a day and about 2 t. butter.... about a month ago, in reviewing my diet, she suggested that I go strictly vegan... no dairy, no animal protein... just legumes, nuts and seeds for protein...
At the time, she said that the lipid levels in my cells were so full of fat, that they were insulin resistant to the fat in the animal protein, just as they were to the carbs, and therefore the glucose that the animal protein breaks down to was not getting into the cells for energy. she said that if I cut out the animal protein, then the cells would be forced to call upon the reserve fat cells for energy...I reluctantly agreed to try it for 3 weeks and was surprised at being able to be satisfied with eating this way... The first week I lost 5 lbs and then consistently between 1-2 lbs a week...
what you are saying seems to confirm what my nutritionist is telling me...
although the legumes are high in carbs, they are also high in fiber, protein and have no fat....therefore, the high carbs are balanced by the fiber and the protein...they take longer to break down to glucose therefore do not raise the sugars...
so basically I eat beans, lots of beans, quinoa ( a perfect protein...a seed...it solves my craving for a 'pasta'), raw veg-lots and lots, raw fruit 1-2 servings a day,seeds and nuts-raw, unsalted, seed, and some cooked veg...
she does want me to limit my fat to 15-18%...therefore I only have 1-2 oz of nuts a day--(if you soak them over night they double in size and are easier to digest)
the few times I have 'slipped' and had just 3 oz of animal protein, I have craved carbs and sugar for the next 24 hrs...
what do you eat Dave?
re: insulin index and protein
David Mendosa
Monday, November 09, 2009 at 10:59 AMDear Barb,
Your nutritionist's advice disturbs me greatly. Our bodies absolutely have to have either carbohydrate or fat for energy. If carbohydrate, you will raise your blood glucose level, making it hard to control your diabetes.
I won't repeat all of what I have written here, because you can read those articles and the reasoning.
But you specifically asked what I eat. See http://www.healthcentral.com/diabetes/c/17/80864/david-diabetes-diet
Best regards,
David
re: re: insulin index and protein
Barb
Monday, November 09, 2009 at 01:51 PMyes, I agree, with you.. perhaps I did not make myself clear.. I am getting protein, vegetable protein in the legumes...and in the quinoa which is a full protein with all of the amino acids....
thanks
re: re: re: insulin index and protein
David Mendosa
Monday, November 09, 2009 at 03:32 PMDear Barb,
Perhaps I didn't make myself clear! The protein you get is essentially irrelevant. You do need some for muscles. But we essentially always get enough protein (all that women need is 46 grams/day, unless they are pregnant or nursing, according to the Institute of Medicine).
The trade-off for ENERGY is between carbohydrates and fat.
Best regards,
David
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What the community is saying...
Contour USB Meter
I also succeeded in using glycemic index and load for keeping my blood glucose under control. I succeeded in losing 40 kilos, I also succeeded in working out 7 days a week, cardio and strength training, eating 1200 calories a day of foods with low glycemic index (below 35), but I cannot succeed in lowering my weight some more (I still have 20 kilos to lose). My weight have been stable for 1 year, my fat tissue is secreting hormones and this is not good for my PCOS, but even with low glycemic index foods, low glycemic load, 1200 calories a day and at least 45 minutes workout a day, every day, I cannot lose the kilos left. This is why an extensive insuline index for almost all the foods would be so helpfull, but no one researches it. I hope someone will, because I do not have the financial resources or the medical training to do it and it would be of so much help for me and others. Doctors in my contry cannot believe that my blood pressure is ok, my blood glucose is ok, my tryglicerides and cholesterol (including bad and good) are ok, due to 5 years of efforts (described above), but I still cannot lose the surplus of 20 kilos - and this is affecting my ovaries, fertility, look, hormones. Many people with insulin resistance and PCOS do not reach results so good, therefore many studies focus on getting them where I am...and I feel like I'm in the air, there are no studies for people like me, who did everything. I also try to help other girls to control their binge-eating, insuline resistance and so on...and I reached a point where I don't have the info to provide to them. I hope researches on insulin index will come up soon.